The Ruid Concept, with question

Ruby
21

thunk wrote:

Funny you should mention this. Four years ago I was “certified” to be
not crazy. And how many of you can say that :wink: -
…
As for not existing, well, wanna bet?? I’m serious, anybody really
smug and sure enough to take on bet about this stuff??? It exists,
and it is doing work of a modest sort - but I cannot think why cannot
do much more.

And that’s just 100% the truth.

Thunk

Not to throw dirt in your face but why did you feel you had to be
tested?

And dude, you are talking like you’re just here to annoy everyone.

If you’re not, then don’t drive off topic like you just did. Please?

I gave you a simple solution to showus some code, without compromising
your work.

And many others here have also done that as well, HECK, trevoke even
made a site for you to show us this stuff! And that’s not something one
can do in about five minutes!

And I just looked through the site, and I’m still at a loss of why, and
what a ruid is. In plan english… what exactly does it do? And please
do’nt go way off topic. I’m practically begging you.

22

On 2010-04-10, H- 16 [email protected] wrote:

thunk wrote:

As for not existing, well, wanna bet??

Why would I bet someone who is obviously a cheater, and doesn’t
understand
how source code works?

Post the project or don’t. If you don’t, it doesn’t exist.

As they say on the internet: Screenshot or it didn’t happen.

I’m serious, anybody really
smug and sure enough to take on bet about this stuff??? It exists,
and it is doing work of a modest sort - but I cannot think why cannot
do much more.

Possibly because it doesn’t really exist, and doesn’t really work,
because
the person supposedly working on it can’t actually complete a simple
declarative sentence in English, and thus presumably does not know what
it supposedly is?

And dude, you are talking like you’re just here to annoy everyone.

Ayup.

And I just looked through the site, and I’m still at a loss of why, and
what a ruid is. In plan english… what exactly does it do? And please
do’nt go way off topic. I’m practically begging you.

He can’t tell you, because he doesn’t have any idea what it does. I
suspect that if we ever do find something, it’ll be a PaulaBean labeled
“brillant”.

-s

23

On Apr 10, 4:12 pm, Seebs [email protected] wrote:

As they say on the internet: Screenshot or it didn’t happen.

And dude, you are talking like you’re just here to annoy everyone.

Ayup.

And I just looked through the site, and I’m still at a loss of why, and
what a ruid is. In plan english… what exactly does it do? And please
do’nt go way off topic. I’m practically begging you.

http://trevoke.net/ruids/index.php?topic=5.0

Pretty much says it. It takes a part in a set of like classes
(therefore the swarm). There are multiple Types but the “standard”
type makes a few assertions, messages get attached (by the expert) and
a conclusion gets reached (5 sections / 5 DSLs)

The “big secret” to making some basic sense of the conclusions is that
each Ruid has basic “categorization” - done into the Header section of
the Ruid.

THEY are simple - so they can be authored using nothing more than a
“picklist” driven “expert session” which would be key part of a DEMO
system (and must be Web based). And was done in WEE and tested and
so on.

The SWARM_READER is in charge of making sense of the “Image” made
after the Ruids contact “Screens”. Screens are about presenting
information (like a patient record) to the Ruid. The Ru’id “docks”
with a “HelperClass” - the HelperClass is something also used by
Ruleby (the author is happy to report).

The “HelperClasses” is where a "Ru’id Programmer must spend his/her
effort.

=================================

If you’ve followed along these terms are somewhat familiar. If not
they may or may not make much sense but if I knew other terms I WOULD
USE THEM. So I have “invented” what makes the very best sense to me -
and adopted when I get clues - for example the term “Boid” is being
carefully avoided. The term “Swarm” fits WAY too well, I am not
giving that one up because the Ruids are executed in “Waves” - a 2nd
wave can use the info deposited by the first Wave and so it goes.

So, Seebs, is this making some sense now, or does this seem like
something from another planet? This medium has limited utility, this
type of thing is best done in conversation and I am sensitive to
glazed looks, and can adjust.
In this medium all I can do is blast my best effort out there and see
the postings to tell me if folks think I’m crazy or not. If I could
not hit f5 and see 200 or so do what they do, well, I guess I’d be
wondering also…

and that’s my run at it, here

Thunk

24

thunk wrote:

http://trevoke.net/ruids/index.php?topic=5.0

Pretty much says it. It takes a part in a set of like classes
(therefore the swarm). There are multiple Types but the “standard”
type makes a few assertions, messages get attached (by the expert) and
a conclusion gets reached (5 sections / 5 DSLs)

The “big secret” to making some basic sense of the conclusions is that
each Ruid has basic “categorization” - done into the Header section of
the Ruid.

THEY are simple - so they can be authored using nothing more than a
“picklist” driven “expert session” which would be key part of a DEMO
system (and must be Web based). And was done in WEE and tested and
so on.

The SWARM_READER is in charge of making sense of the “Image” made
after the Ruids contact “Screens”. Screens are about presenting
information (like a patient record) to the Ruid. The Ru’id “docks”
with a “HelperClass” - the HelperClass is something also used by
Ruleby (the author is happy to report).

The “HelperClasses” is where a "Ru’id Programmer must spend his/her
effort.

=================================

Ok, so what’s the entire point of the program? What EXACTLY does it do?
And can you give us even a LITTLE code. If you can’t you can’t be
helped.

P.S. If you haven’t noticed I’m just about the only one giving you a
chance right about now. I wouldn’t take that kindness for granted. Nuff
said…

25

On Sat, Apr 10, 2010 at 3:40 PM, thunk [email protected] wrote:

Andrew McElroy

Was confident enough to announce to this group what he thought this
was, right?

There is no shame in giving some the benefit of the doubt they have
something up front.

On his side there were kids needing piano lessons, and a SawsAll. On

What the explicative are you talking about?
I don’t have any children.
I do animal rescue and work on try ruby. That’s as close as that gets to
what your talking about.

my side, I was in total awe of his understanding of all this and he
told me about Python and functions and Google and I made a lot of
notes in a 15/20 minute conversation which… made sense to me.

Because python and google (which are off topic here) are real things.
They can be understood. Your boid/ruids are pretty much an ambiguous
religion.
Even time cube is more coherent.
There are no artifacts that can be observed. You might as well be
screaming
about
an alien language you learned from light reflections off of titan.

I was ready to drive to Hendersonville to meet him, as, yes, I rather
old fashioned about who I trust.

Given the way he is framing things that decision, in retrospect, seems
like it makes sense. Or?

An ad hominem attack is quiet tempting right now.
Ad hominem - Wikipedia

The best thing you can do is unsubscribe from this list and get mental
help.
Seriously, the symptoms you display are in the DSM-IV-TR.
This is no joke.

26

On Apr 10, 8:00 pm, H- 16 [email protected] wrote:

the Ruid.
Ruleby (the author is happy to report).
P.S. If you haven’t noticed I’m just about the only one giving you a
chance right about now. I wouldn’t take that kindness for granted. Nuff
said…
–
Posted viahttp://www.ruby-forum.com/.

Dear H-16

ahhhh Thunk did not come here asking a specific question. His subject
title was “It’s a Bird, it’s a Plane, um, ahhh, it’s a Boid?” and, I
believe it was a clear question of “what are these things”. Well,
nobody has been able to say (I had code up) but thunk thinks it is
clear that since it is not threaded or fibered (and does not need
this) it is something “new”, and so was born a new name that did not
any carry AI baggage.

No desire to repeat himself, sorry, but there is a lot of confusion,
it might seem. How can such a simple plug-let class be useful?

BTW are you any relation to H-8 (my very first computer from
Heathkit :slight_smile: )

27

On Fri, Apr 9, 2010 at 3:55 PM, thunk [email protected] wrote:

The Ruid Concept

QUESTION

Why would this not be an appropriate topic for this board??

But it is! Look how many replies you got!!! People just love to kid
with you (YHS e.g.) or holler at you (some others).
Or would you like to get somehow “more” out of it?
Cheers
Robert

28

On Apr 10, 8:00 pm, H- 16 [email protected] wrote:

the Ruid.
Ruleby (the author is happy to report).
P.S. If you haven’t noticed I’m just about the only one giving you a
chance right about now. I wouldn’t take that kindness for granted. Nuff
said…
–
Posted viahttp://www.ruby-forum.com/.

There is some general utility for certain problem types.

Just about “any” report / data processing Could be done in a system
like this but that would make very little sense! However there are
several easy to represent problem types where the system would present
many significant advantages due to the fact that the Ru’id units can
be contributed from “outside” the system (via an expert web session).
The simplest set to recognize, imho, is “the shopping basket” (system)
situation. Ru’ids could tear apart everything and anything in a
shopping basket and make sense of what there is to make sense of (eg
if it is a single computer they could give you a report on peer
systems, tell you your cables are too small, and that you may be
forgetting the CPU heat sink grease.) That was the ORIGINAL idea - 3
years ago.

http://trevoke.net/ruids/index.php?topic=3.0

29

Why would this not be an appropriate topic for this board??

But it is! Look how many replies you got!!! People just love to kid
with you (YHS e.g.) or holler at you (some others).
Or would you like to get somehow “more” out of it?
Cheers
Robert

My buzzword trap has caught a few things; DISTRIBUTED is something I
“know” but didn’t have a clue on how to express. The intrinsic (?)
value of these things seem to be that they can be “generated” via a
simple web “session”. Where, here “session” means “filling out a
form, basically”. Without that word it was steep up-hill but even
with it, not much glimmer of recognition here, seemingly, on what this
could mean.

I concocted a “realistic” (as far as I know) scenario where a life (or
2 or 3) could be saved daily - but the question came up only on
“Games”.

The answer is a resounding YES but the open source world continues to
confound me with things like IronRuby OPEN-SOURCE from MicroSoft???
My golly, are they not the Evil Empire? And why was “Matz” (a
genuine HERO, in my book) wearing a Python T-Shirt? at IronRuby.

I am feeling OK with it all given the sandbox to put the situation up
in once somewhat cohesive manner at

http://trevoke.net/ruids/

(nothing for sale, only ideas on how something could happen that makes
sense to everybody (including me) given all the circumstances. Just
putting it up to a gitHub without support, without documentation, and
“to see what happens” just does not seem to make any sense.)

On the other hand - honestly - the more I have learned the more I
think it could be an interesting contribution at the right time.

George

30

…

This said I completely understand your frustration about not being
understood ore honored at your true value. As a matter of fact few of
us are and communication problems play a major role in this.

Robert,

Some people have asked “What does it do?”, and my internal reaction to
this is “what does Ruby do?” because I cannot answer the 2nd question
without saying it is a “Computer Language something like Smalltalk” or
so.

This “Ru’id Framework” so to say is NOT a language, and not really a
FrameWork anything like Wee, Ramaze Web are frameworks.

I had my head “stuck” into the code, and I was not thinking everyday
“what does this do”, I was thinking much more only “how to I get this
all to come together so it does what I need it to do?”.
Encapsulating “pieces of expertise” is a longer range goal, not an
immediate goal.

Today, after your posting, I started thinking “Concept” - what’s the
overall concept and I have started writing something more on that up
at that sandbox of mine THANK YOU ‘TREVOKE’ Whoever you are!!
Because these threads are not really good for such things.

But just thinking about this for a few minutes I believe it only first
came to me that a “Complexity” bullet is/was dodged by using all kinds
of Dynamic OO - that otherwise would have been a super MESS.

As things are now: These “Ru’ids” can just keep being appended to a
“kicked off system” with ZERO changes to the system - theoretically.
However New Classes and New methods into existing classes can expand
the capability at anytime. These two “modules” are the only place
non-system work would be done in a “Ru’id farm” which is a
knowledge_base but because of the distributed nature of the Ru’ids can
come from anybody, any… blablabla - I’ve said all this before.
The Web does this for us. So - this is about “leveraging the Web” -
another thing I’ll have to think about - but it is true - its a way
for a Doctor in Israel to record the result of an Event, and for that
piece of information to get wrapped into a bundle of text, shot around
the USA, and pop up in Boston just in time to save a life (or make a
move in a checkers game?)…

I’ll keep spending time in my “sandbox” and explaining this better as
I strain to think about this all. Thanks for making me think on
this. Remember I was very involved with software that did this stuff
inside corporations in the 1990s BUT IT WAS NOT 'WEB" - it was “my”
stuff. However, although I could be surprised, it sure seems like the
Web can transfer a silly little Text File - and that is, from the
outside, all these things are! A certain Michael F had this all set
up at horrific speeds using some library from FaceBook that I can’t
think of (BeanStalk?). The performance seemed unbelievable.

George

31

This “Ru’id Framework” so to say is NOT a language, and not really a
FrameWork  anything like Wee, Ramaze  Web are frameworks.

It’s not a language. It is not a framework. It’s not even an idea.
It’s just a device you use to spam the list. There is no code,
there will never be any code. Just more text which makes no sense.
I don’t know, maybe you did produce FIVE systems “inside coroporations”
but looks like those days are long over. All you are producing is noise.

Regards,
Rimantas

32

On Tue, Apr 13, 2010 at 6:15 PM, thunk [email protected] wrote:

My buzzword trap has caught a few things; DISTRIBUTED is something I

(nothing for sale, only ideas on how something could happen that makes
sense to everybody (including me) given all the circumstances. Just
putting it up to a gitHub without support, without documentation, and
“to see what happens” just does not seem to make any sense.)

On the other hand - honestly - the more I have learned the more I
think it could be an interesting contribution at the right time.

It sure could be, but maybe the fact is that we simply do not
understand what you are talking about? If you are not understood it is
completely useless to repeat over and over again what you are saying,
it might however help to use the language of the people you are
talking too. As you might undoubtedly conclude from my writings I am
one of those poor non native speakers, who have to settle of a very
simple usage of English in order to communicate…
This said I completely understand your frustration about not being
understood ore honored at your true value. As a matter of fact few of
us are and communication problems play a major role in this.

HTH
R.