Ruby Future Or?

I was thinking today and I was wondering if ruby has a future when
python is being to widely accepted. Outside of rails, because I have no
want to code in rails. Should I move back to python, or will ruby get
more popular where I can stay with the language I enjoy coding in and
can be productive.

Thanks

I guess it depends on what you mean by “having a future”. Ruby’s never
going to compete on a performance basis with, say, C or x86, no
matter how good it gets (unless there’s a radical transformation in
how the language works). But that’s okay, because every language is
good at different things. Ruby is great for a sizable number of those
things (expressive domain modeling, scripting, web applications,
etc.), at the expense of being less good for some of them (shuttle
launch software, onboard missile guidance, etc.).

It’s always up to the developer to pick the right tool for the job,
not the popular tool for the job.

John F.
Principal Consultant, BitsBuilder
LI: http://www.linkedin.com/in/johnxf
SO: http://stackoverflow.com/users/75170/

On 15.05.2011 13:31, Robert J. wrote:

I was thinking today and I was wondering if ruby has a future when
python is being to widely accepted. Outside of rails, because I have no
want to code in rails.

If I could answer your question I would be in possession of a crystal
ball and be making money predicting lottery results of next week.

Don’t speculate too much. As long as there are enough people using Ruby
it will stay. Remember when they said Cobol was dead? That must be
ages already and what happened: there are still Cobol coders around. I
just yesterday talked to one in person.

Cheers

robert

On 05/15/11 22:00, Robert K. wrote:

there are still Cobol coders around. I just
yesterday talked to one in person.

ahh, but did s/he answer you? :stuck_out_tongue:

(ref to Wayne and Shuster)

On 05/15/2011 04:31 AM, Robert J. wrote:

I was thinking today and I was wondering if ruby has a future when
python is being to widely accepted. Outside of rails, because I have no
want to code in rails.

Well, what kind of code do you want to write? There are still some of
us here who use ruby for things other than rails.

On 15.05.2011 14:57, Clifford H. wrote:

On 05/15/11 22:00, Robert K. wrote:

there are still Cobol coders around. I just
yesterday talked to one in person.

ahh, but did s/he answer you? :stuck_out_tongue:

(ref to Wayne and Shuster)

Yes, she did! :slight_smile:

robert

On Sun, May 15, 2011 at 08:31:39PM +0900, Robert J. wrote:

I was thinking today and I was wondering if ruby has a future when
python is being to widely accepted. Outside of rails, because I have no
want to code in rails.

I haven’t used Rails in five years. I use Ruby daily.

Ruby is actually used heavily in some software management tools on
FreeBSD. It is used for a lot of network applications (i.e., an IRC
dicebot called “drollbot” that I wrote, as well as craptons of other
things other people write). It’s great for nontrivial sysadmin
utilities. It’s an excellent introductory language for people knew to
(object oriented) programming. It’s heavily used for test automation.
It serves well for “enterprise integration” tasks. It offers a fast and
easy way to construct GUI applications without selling your soul to
Visual Basic. Unlike the majority of software out there (like MS
Windows, Firefox, and Photoshop), Ruby tends to get faster with new
versions. It is popular enough to have close to a dozen different
implementations. Thanks to one of those – JRuby – it runs almost
anywhere Java runs, and thanks to another – IronRuby – it is a viable
choice for certain types of programming with the .NET framework. Ruby
is
being used to develop implementations of other languages, including its
use in developing a Ruby implementation called Rubinius. It offers
abstraction facilities that Python lacks (see functional programming
constructs and metaprogramming for examples).

Perhaps most importantly, it’s fun.

The fact that Python is more popular in some contexts than Ruby does not
mean that Ruby is doomed. That’s short-sighted, unenlightened thinking.

Python and Ruby are pretty much in the same boat. Python won’t be the
Ruby killer. Ruby is also widely accepted at this time. It’s concepts
and paradigm will be around for along time to come. If anything has
changed in the last decade maybe perl usage has slowed down. But perl
is not going anywhere anytime soon. Even awk is still used today.
Maybe not to the extent it was twenty and thirty years ago but it’s
still a useful tool for what it’s meant for.

I realize you have no interest in rails. There are many tools to
create dynamic web projects with. Many gems in the ruby world to aid
to that effect without using rails. Now the politics of evaluating and
educating your ‘pointy haired boss’ what tools and frameworks to use
outside of rails is left to your own discretion. I realize this wont
be simple task because your employer most likely has been pounded with
buzz terms such as ‘agile’ ‘web2.0’ ‘refactoring’ ‘cloud’ ‘scrum’
‘tdd’ ‘bdd’ ‘ruby on rails’ ‘ajax’ and probably would have never heard
of this programming language from the far east if it wasn’t for the
buzz in the last several years.

I wouldn’t worry to much though about displacement. Ruby is here to
stay.

On 15/05/11 14:31 , Robert J. wrote:

I was thinking today and I was wondering if ruby has a future when
python is being to widely accepted. Outside of rails, because I have no
want to code in rails.

Been coding in Ruby since 2001 and I’ve never done Rails while I have
done only minimal web application programming.
In the last 5 years I code almost exclusively in Ruby mostly building
tools that build tools, that build tools ad infinitum.
When I started I was the only person using Ruby in my firm and in any of
my client’s firms.
There used to be the Python vs. Ruby question in our ptojects but that
has stopped being asked now as there’s at least 10 people with
significant Ruby experience in the firm and we have a whole heap of
tools and knowledge to fall back on.
So no, I don’t see Ruby going away anytime soon.
Cheers,
V.-

On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 05:30:53PM +0900, spiralofhope wrote:

Perhaps you are asking: “Do you think that in the future I will be able
to find work programming with Ruby, even if I don’t want to program
with Rails?”

Ahh, now that’s a different question.

From what I’ve seen, Rails is a primary job skill sought by employers.
Ruby without Rails, however, seems to be just a “bonus”, if employers
notice it at all.

On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 12:48 PM, Chad P. [email protected] wrote:

From what I’ve seen, Rails is a primary job skill sought by employers.
Ruby without Rails, however, seems to be just a “bonus”, if employers
notice it at all.

It depends. We (Engine Y.) employ several people for whom Ruby
related work is their daily bread and butter, but those people do not
spend their days writing Rails apps.

Kirk H.
Software Guy
Engine Y.

On May 15, 1:25pm, Stu [email protected] wrote:

Python and Ruby are pretty much in the same boat. Python won’t be the
Ruby killer.

My prediction? Javascript eventually kills the other dynamic languages
in the web development arena. Why use two languages when you can use
one?

Regards,

Dan

On Sun, 15 May 2011 20:31:39 +0900
Robert J. [email protected] wrote:

I was thinking today and I was wondering if ruby has a future when
python is being to widely accepted. Outside of rails, because I have
no want to code in rails.

I was thinking today and I was wondering if apples have a future when
oranges are being widely accepted. Outside of apple pie, because I
have no want to eat apples. =)

Perhaps you are asking: “Do you think that in the future I will be able
to find work programming with Ruby, even if I don’t want to program
with Rails?”

Seeing that I was referring to UNIX shell scripting I don’t see how
this applies.

On Sun, May 15, 2011 at 7:31 AM, Robert J. [email protected]
wrote:

I was thinking today and I was wondering if ruby has a future when
python is being to widely accepted. Outside of rails, because I have no
want to code in rails.

I found it interesting to see Walter Bright (creator of D) comment in an
interview that he thought Ruby was the language to watch (see the very
last
question in the interview):

http://www.bitwisemag.com/copy/programming/d/interview/d_programming_language.html

On Tue, 17 May 2011 06:20:54 +0900
Daniel B. removed_em[email protected] wrote:

My prediction? Javascript eventually kills the other dynamic languages
in the web development arena. Why use two languages when you can use
one?

I agree, but only in the sense that there are some fantastic tools[1]
out there which abstract things and present an alternate syntax.

Variety is demanded when people disagree strongly on the use of a
single tool. But if that single tool has a way of being used
differently by those different people, then less people will disagree,
and less strongly.

[1] The one example that comes to mind is http://jquery.com/

On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 06:20:54AM +0900, Daniel B. wrote:

My prediction? Javascript eventually kills the other dynamic languages
in the web development arena. Why use two languages when you can use
one?

. . . just as soon as a new version of JavaScript that doesn’t include
some of those seriously sucky characteristics that make JavaScript
painful to use sometimes is released to the world.

No . . . I don’t think JavaScript will kill Ruby and/or Python, except
perhaps within limited constraints.

On 5/16/11 4:17 PM, Thiel C. wrote:

Variety is demanded when people disagree strongly on the use of a
single tool. But if that single tool has a way of being used
differently by those different people, then less people will disagree,
and less strongly.

[1] The one example that comes to mind is http://jquery.com/

I disagree with Daniel. Program languages cannot be predicted. Distrust
anyone who claims to know the programming language future, however dimly.
If astrology worked, all astrologers would be rich. :slight_smile:

If you want to equate 15 years of experience, job trending and tech
trending to astrology, sure.

Regards,

Dan

On Tue, May 17, 2011 at 05:31:11AM +0900, Kirk H. wrote:

On Mon, May 16, 2011 at 12:48 PM, Chad P. [email protected] wrote:

From what I’ve seen, Rails is a primary job skill sought by employers.
Ruby without Rails, however, seems to be just a “bonus”, if employers
notice it at all.

It depends. We (Engine Y.) employ several people for whom Ruby
related work is their daily bread and butter, but those people do not
spend their days writing Rails apps.

I have two questions:

  1. Did you hire them for their Ruby-not-Rails skills, or hire them for
    their Ruby on Rails skills and end up putting them to work with Ruby
    that
    is not attached to Rails?

  2. Do you know of any other businesses that hire people for Ruby skills
    that aren’t related to Rails and are not basically the Google of Ruby
    employers?

Of all the job postings I’ve noticed that mention Ruby in job
requirements, 100% of them also mention Rails.

Op 16-5-2011 23:49, spiralofhope schreef:

single tool. But if that single tool has a way of being used
differently by those different people, then less people will disagree,
and less strongly.

[1] The one example that comes to mind is http://jquery.com/

I disagree with Daniel. Program languages cannot be predicted. Distrust
anyone who claims to know the programming language future, however
dimly.
If astrology worked, all astrologers would be rich. :slight_smile:

Thiel C.

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