Problems with Posting to comp.lang.ruby, due to gateway to R

Ruby
1

Hello

There seems to be a problem how the newsgroupd comp.lang.ruby is
handled. Here a concrete example to demonstrate it:

(1) I have posted a message to comp.lang.ruby via Newsoffice (a web
based
Newsreader, http://www.newsoffice.de). You can see this posting for
example at

http://groups.google.com/group/ruby-talk-google/msg/6132dc5ece61114f?dmode=source&hl=de

From the header of this posting, one can see that there is a gateway
involved, mapping comp.lang.ruby postings to the mailing list
[email protected].

(2) I received a followup to this posting which you can see at

http://groups.google.com/group/ruby-talk-google/msg/6132dc5ece61114f?dmode=source&hl=de

My posting was obviously read by someone subscribed to Ruby-Talk, and
his reply was obviously sent to the mailing list, not to the
comp.lang.ruby gateway. Since I am not subscribed to Ruby-Talk

  • actually, I wasn’t even aware of the existence of this mailing
    list -, I would not have even noticed that I got a followup to my
    posting. I found out by accident, when I did a search with Google
    Groups (http://groups.google.com/) and, since GoogleGroups is subscribed
    to Ruby-Talk and also recognized that there was a message to my original
    post, I found that reply.

(3) I posted a followup to that message using GoogleGroups. That
message was of course directed to the ruby-talk mailing list directly,
not to comp.lang.ruby, since the message I was replying to, (2), was
also to the Mailing List, and Googlegroups can’t know from this context
that it should post the reply to comp.lang.ruby.

(4) Then I received a message from the ruby-talk mailing list that I am
not a member of the Ruby-Talk list and hence are not allowed to send
postings there.

The problem seems that though everyone can post to the ruby-talk mailing
list via comp.lang.ruby gateway, only members can post to the mailing
list directly. This has the consequence that a message posted to
comp.lang.ruby can be read by subscribers to ruby-talk AND
comp.lang.ruby,
but followups to such a posting don’t necessarily show up in the
comp.lang.ruby usegroup. In other words: The gateway between
comp.lang.ruby and ruby-talk is one way only.

Maybe there is an error how that gateway between comp.lang.ruby and
ruby-talk is configured? How can one find out who is responsible for
operating this gateway?

Ronald

2

Ronald F. wrote:

(3) I posted a followup to that message using GoogleGroups. That
message was of course directed to the ruby-talk mailing list directly,
not to comp.lang.ruby, since the message I was replying to, (2), was
also to the Mailing List, and Googlegroups can’t know from this context
that it should post the reply to comp.lang.ruby.

(4) Then I received a message from the ruby-talk mailing list that I am
not a member of the Ruby-Talk list and hence are not allowed to send
postings there.

there are two google groups, one is an archive of the newsgroup and the
other an archive the mailing-list called ruby-talk-google. which did
you use? if its the later, it shouldn’t let you post unless you
subscribe first (via google groups).

ruby-talk is configured? How can one find out who is responsible for
operating this gateway?

not sure who’s running the gateway, but king james II wrote it :wink:

T.

3

On Jan 9, 2007, at 5:57 AM, Trans wrote:

How can one find out who is responsible for
operating this gateway?

not sure who’s running the gateway, but king james II wrote it :wink:

I wrote and maintain the current Gateway.

James Edward G. II

4

On Jan 9, 2007, at 2:45 AM, Ronald F. wrote:

There seems to be a problem how the newsgroupd comp.lang.ruby is
handled.

There are, from time to time, problems with messages not moving from
one side of the Gateway to another. These almost always involve
multipart messages.

Just FYI, I explain the scope of the Gateway here:

http://blog.grayproductions.net/articles/2006/12/01/what-is-the-ruby-
talk-gateway

(1) I have posted a message to comp.lang.ruby via Newsoffice (a web
based
Newsreader, http://www.newsoffice.de). You can see this posting for
example at
http://groups.google.com/group/ruby-talk-google/msg/
6132dc5ece61114f?dmode=source&hl=de

I’ve looked into this thread and do not see a problem. The messages
appear to have been gated correctly. Here’s a link to the thread on
the Usenet side:

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/comp.lang.ruby/browse_thread/
thread/e30bf5b62fb2ded6/56910ec15ff3617d?lnk=gst&q=Net%3A%
3ATelnet&rnum=1#56910ec15ff3617d

Both messages show up there. They also both hit the mailing list:

http://blade.nagaokaut.ac.jp/cgi-bin/scat.rb/ruby/ruby-talk/233092

http://blade.nagaokaut.ac.jp/cgi-bin/scat.rb/ruby/ruby-talk/233131

Unless I am missing something, everything appears to be functioning
correctly.

James Edward G. II

5

there are two google groups, one is an archive of the newsgroup and the
other an archive the mailing-list called ruby-talk-google. which did
you use? if its the later, it shouldn’t let you post unless you
subscribe first (via google groups).

The first posting, remember, wasn’t done with Google, but with
Newsoffice;
and there I posted just to comp.lang.ruby.

When I posted the reply, I did it with GoogleGroups, but here, Google
didn’t
let me choose “comp.lang.ruby”. It offered only “reply to the author”
and
“reply to Ruby-Talk”.

not sure who’s running the gateway, but king james II wrote it :wink:

A strong argument against monarchy :stuck_out_tongue:

Ronald

6

James Edward G. II schrieb:

http://blade.nagaokaut.ac.jp/cgi-bin/scat.rb/ruby/ruby-talk/233092

http://blade.nagaokaut.ac.jp/cgi-bin/scat.rb/ruby/ruby-talk/233131

Unless I am missing something, everything appears to be functioning
correctly.

I can demonstrate you the problem by two screenshots. First have a look
at http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/9601/capture1sw6.jpg .It shows
the message by Rodrigo which I am going to answer (the “hand” shaped
cursor points to the link “Antworten mit Zitat”, which means “Reply
with
Quoting”).

Now have a look at the second screenshot, taken after I clicked on
“Antworten mit Zitat”:
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/281/capture2wc7.jpg
You see that I can choose to either reply to Rodrigo by mail,
or to Reply to Ruby-Talk. There is no way to Reply to comp.lang.ruby!

Of course the question is now: Is this due to an error at GoogleGroups,
or because the message header of Rodrigo’s message is faulty.
Unfortunately I don’t have enogh knowledge to decide this.
My guess is that GoogleGroups just doesn’t get the idea that I could
want to reply to comp.lang.ruby…

Ronald

7

On Jan 10, 2007, at 2:50 AM, Ronny wrote:

I can demonstrate you the problem by two screenshots. First have a
look
at http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/9601/capture1sw6.jpg .It shows
the message by Rodrigo which I am going to answer (the “hand” shaped
cursor points to the link “Antworten mit Zitat”, which means “Reply
with Quoting”).

Interesting. The English interface of Google G. has “Reply” and
“Reply to Author” where you are pointing in the screenshot. Both
include quoting. “Reply” builds a message addressed to
comp.lang.ruby and “Reply to Author” builds a response to Rodrigo.
(There is no way I can see to email Ruby T…)

As I see it, that tells us three things:

  • This has nothing to do with the Ruby Gateway
  • Google can get the interface right, when they want to
  • The Google interface in your language is broken

I suggest you file a bug and consider alternate means to interact
with comp.lang.ruby.

James Edward G. II

8

On 1/10/07, James Edward G. II [email protected] wrote:

I suggest you file a bug and consider alternate means to interact
with comp.lang.ruby.

And seeing as how he’s using a gmail account anyway, I’d suggest
subscribing to the mailing list from there, and filtering all posts
into a separate label. I did that when my nntp server was acting up,
and it works well enough that I feel no desire to go back to the
newsgroup view.

martin

9

James G. wrote:

  • This has nothing to do with the Ruby Gateway
  • Google can get the interface right, when they want to
  • The Google interface in your language is broken

I suggest you file a bug and consider alternate means to interact
with comp.lang.ruby.

RubyForum (www.ruby-forum.com) is one such alternative.
IMHO it’s very nice and convenient, with RSS feeds galore!

10

On Jan 15, 2007, at 1:20 AM, Ronny wrote:

I don’t think that it is obvious to
everyone that
when you start a discussion on the usenet, you are finally required to
also
subscribe to a mailing list in order to continue the discussion.

You’re not. As long as your Usenet client is behaving. :wink:

James Edward G. II

11

Martin DeMello schrieb:

On 1/10/07, James Edward G. II [email protected] wrote:

I suggest you file a bug and consider alternate means to interact
with comp.lang.ruby.

And seeing as how he’s using a gmail account anyway,

Actually I nearly never use the gmail account. I was kind of forced by
Google
to get it in order to post.

I’d suggest
subscribing to the mailing list from there, and filtering all posts
into a separate label.

Yes, this would work, but the main problem is that what I am
experiencing,
might happen to many people. I don’t think that it is obvious to
everyone that
when you start a discussion on the usenet, you are finally required to
also
subscribe to a mailing list in order to continue the discussion.

From what I learned, the error is likely not within the
Usenet-Mailinglist-Gateway,
but in the way GoogleGroups handles them, so it should be Google which
correct
it. But of course they don’t care about these issues. I have reported
the problem
to them several days ago, but as you might guess, I never got an
answer.

Ronald