Forum: Ruby on Rails Learn Ruby before Learning Ruby on Rails ?

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57da59be39f7c9256b5cd346784ca049?d=identicon&s=25 Vs Yr (vasu)
on 2006-05-23 07:09
hello Friends,

I am a newbie to "Ruby or Ruby on Rails".  A J2EE application architect
at my day job. A fairly experienced PHP web-developer as well.  After
reading into the many articles on Ruby/ROR, have to admit looks pretty
good so far. Really serious about getting into this and possibly
developing some good Web 2.0 applications.

Just wondering the best way to learn Ruby on Rails. Is it good to learn
"Ruby" the language first and then jump into learning the Framework (
ROR ) or it it best to pick up the language while learning/working with
R.O.R ?

Please share your thoughts...

Thanks,
vasu.
47d626d416d9da060a44ed9f684e32cf?d=identicon&s=25 Riko (Guest)
on 2006-05-23 09:29
(Received via mailing list)
VS YR wrote:

> Just wondering the best way to learn Ruby on Rails. Is it good to learn
> "Ruby" the language first and then jump into learning the Framework (
> ROR ) or it it best to pick up the language while learning/working with
> R.O.R ?

You can learn Rails without knowing much Ruby (in fact the syntax is
quite selfexplaining, there are not a lot of "unexpected" things). You
may read a very quick ruby tutorial (just to understand what a block is
and to see a couple of example on how to use it, for example).

However, learning Ruby will show you how much fun is to develop with
Ruby in contrast to the languages you already know. That is the point:
coding in Ruby is not only productive. It is also amusing.


--
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91eb330fb36d1e03c856574dfb77d2bc?d=identicon&s=25 Thibaut Barrère (thbar)
on 2006-05-23 10:41
(Received via mailing list)
>
> Just wondering the best way to learn Ruby on Rails. Is it good to learn
> "Ruby" the language first and then jump into learning the Framework (
> ROR ) or it it best to pick up the language while learning/working with
> R.O.R ?


Welcome ! My experience is similar to yours.

I found out that it's worth - and fun! - to learn bits of ruby while
developing your first application (like say, let's spend one hour on
those
Time or Date objects and see what's possible inthere).

I usually launch IRB, or create simple Test::Unit fixtures when my tests
are
more complicated (so I can come back later and see, well that's how I
parse
a date properly etc).

Have a look at those two books:
- http://www.pragmaticprogrammer.com/titles/ruby/index.html
- http://pleac.sourceforge.net/pleac_ruby/

hope this helps

Thibaut
1fba4539b6cafe2e60a2916fa184fc2f?d=identicon&s=25 unknown (Guest)
on 2006-05-23 11:20
(Received via mailing list)
Hi --

On Tue, 23 May 2006, VS YR wrote:

> ROR ) or it it best to pick up the language while learning/working with
> R.O.R ?
>
> Please share your thoughts...

You can definitely jump into the Rails framework, picking up some Ruby
as you go, and then after that, if you want to get more deeply into
Rails, you'll want to learn Ruby more deeply as part of that process.

There's even a new book for people in exactly your situation:
"Ruby for Rails: Ruby techniques for Rails developers".  Yes, I'm the
author, not a neutral party.  But the kind of thing you're interested
in is exactly *why* I wrote it :-)

You can get some sample chapters at http://www.manning.com/black.


David

--
David A. Black (dblack@wobblini.net)
* Ruby Power and Light, LLC (http://www.rubypowerandlight.com)
   > Ruby and Rails consultancy and training
* Sample chapters of "Ruby for Rails" from Manning Publications
   > at http://www.manning.com/black
8f153c7bcf3ef5865370564513965cf4?d=identicon&s=25 Dave Pawson (Guest)
on 2006-05-23 14:09
(Received via mailing list)
On 23/05/06, Thibaut Barrère <thibaut.barrere@gmail.com> wrote:
> Time or Date objects and see what's possible inthere).
>

+1. Another new user of a couple of weeks.
Usual trick, open up an editor and try the different bits as hacks
to show syntax and act as an aide memoire when you've forgotten.

  Ruby has its own quirks, as most languages do. They do take
some getting used to, but so far I'm also having fun with it?
Makes me smile the same way Python did.
I'm guessing having at least an awareness of Ruby will increase
the options when writing rails apps.


HTH

--
Dave Pawson
XSLT XSL-FO FAQ.
http://www.dpawson.co.uk
76ade6a3bc9aadb33df39c735caf46f7?d=identicon&s=25 Bill Clinton (bclinton)
on 2006-05-23 14:18
VS YR wrote:
> hello Friends,
>
> I am a newbie to "Ruby or Ruby on Rails".  A J2EE application architect
> at my day job. A fairly experienced PHP web-developer as well.

I am new to Ruby, but like you I have developed many web apps in Java
and PHP.  I agree with the others: jump right in to RoR.  But if you
decide to develop a serious application, I suggest you get a Ruby book.
When you don't have a solid grasp of the language, the fun can turn to
frustration when you start to do things that are a little trickier.
30ee518e6fdc5b07e060775b5a542bdb?d=identicon&s=25 Jón Borgþórsson (jongretar)
on 2006-05-23 15:15
(Received via mailing list)
I agree. I personally decided to buy both Agile web dev with Rails AND
Programming Ruby at the sam time in the start. They have similar
structure so it helped to know the bare basics in Ruby. But after
playing arround in RoR for a while you will be suprised on how much
Ruby you actually know since the line between Ruby and RoR is a bit
fuzzy. RoR feels much more like an extension to Ruby more than most
frameworks.


On 5/23/06, Bill Clinton <bclinton@rangercomputer.com> wrote:
> frustration when you start to do things that are a little trickier.
>
>
> --
> Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
> _______________________________________________
> Rails mailing list
> Rails@lists.rubyonrails.org
> http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails
>


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2a9c22889b0dc4614db14c9e2a9c5a12?d=identicon&s=25 Bill Edstrom, Jr. (Guest)
on 2006-05-23 15:31
(Received via mailing list)
Hi,
I just went through this very same endeavor. Looking back, I think its
best
to start with the book Agile Development with Rails and just burn
through
the examples to get a feel for RoR. I tried reading the "Pickaxe" book
on
Ruby but the most helpful was to pickup Learn to Program. That book is
so
simple but quickly clarifies how Ruby syntax works. I found it very
helpful
to load a text editor and paste examples into the the IRB command line
and
just play around with ruby object and iterators.
7438e24e40d16589fd11a5b4b360c4d6?d=identicon&s=25 Michael Ward (Guest)
on 2006-05-23 16:32
> There's even a new book for people in exactly your situation:
> "Ruby for Rails: Ruby techniques for Rails developers".  Yes, I'm the
> author, not a neutral party.  But the kind of thing you're interested
> in is exactly *why* I wrote it :-)

I second the author - the Ruby for Rails book is a very good starting
point for learning ruby with rails in mind. You'll get to know Ruby and
your new knowledge will be relevant for RoR.

You can then move on to the Agile book with more understanding and can
polish your ruby knowledge with the pickaxe book.
53cca1f55d947a176d419736ab639f1e?d=identicon&s=25 Bala Paranj (Guest)
on 2006-05-23 20:34
(Received via mailing list)
I love this book. I bought it last week and I have finished the first
three chapters. It makes it
easy for the beginners to learn Ruby. I will be posting review of this
book on Amazon after I
finish it. Good job Mr. Black !!! Thanks to Manning for publishing such
a great book!!

--- Michael Ward <m.ward@leythers.com> wrote:

> polish your ruby knowledge with the pickaxe book.
>
> --
> Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
> _______________________________________________
> Rails mailing list
> Rails@lists.rubyonrails.org
> http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails
>


http://www.ProblemSolvingSkill.net
Hone your problem-solving skills
Eea7ad39737b0dbf3de38874e0a6c7d8?d=identicon&s=25 Justin Forder (Guest)
on 2006-05-24 01:35
(Received via mailing list)
VS YR wrote:
> ROR ) or it it best to pick up the language while learning/working with
> R.O.R ?
>
> Please share your thoughts...
>
> Thanks,
> vasu.
>

Hello Vasu

Others have given you lots of good advice. From your job description, I
assume you can afford to buy "Agile Web Development with Ruby on Rails"
(AWDR) and a Ruby book - either the Pickaxe book (Programming Ruby) or
David Black's "Ruby for Rails" book (which I confess I haven't read,
apart from looking at the downloadable sample content).

Coming from Java, you should find Jim Weirich's presentation "10 Things
Every Java Programmer Should Know About Ruby" useful:

    http://onestepback.org/articles/10things/

Once you have these resources, the main question is how much time you
spend following tutorials before starting on your own choice of
application. If you have the time, I suggest you go through all the
tutorial content in the second edition of AWDR (beta, PDF only at
present) before choosing your own sample application to work on.

have fun

   Justin
024e4717cdf03bb03179a9594805431d?d=identicon&s=25 Pat Lynch (Guest)
on 2006-05-24 04:12
(Received via mailing list)
Hi,

I'm only a month ahead of you. I'm learning Ruby and RoR [Ruby on Rails]
simultaneously.

I found the following two books to be extremely helpful:

1. "Programming Ruby The Pragmatic Programmer's Guide" -- nicknamed the
"Pickaxe book"

2. "Agile Web Development with Rails" -- often abbreviated as "AWDWR" --
supposedly, there is a second edition coming out shortly...

My goal is to put up three web applications using RoR. They will be:
1. Shopping Cart
2. QA Metrics System
3. Inventory Management System.

I wish both of us luck.

Cheers,
Pat
024e4717cdf03bb03179a9594805431d?d=identicon&s=25 Pat Lynch (Guest)
on 2006-05-24 04:52
(Received via mailing list)
Sounds good, I just purchased a copy...
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