Forum: Ruby on Rails disadvantages of Ruby on Rails

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51e25e353f0a0d2cdfb2e841725a72c1?d=identicon&s=25 Rajdeep Pohanerkar (rajrkodeep)
on 2007-04-03 05:29
can anyone tell that what are the disadvantages f Ruby on Rails lets
Discuss
C8f50904773abc5a7d39741f690662e0?d=identicon&s=25 John (Guest)
on 2007-04-03 05:34
(Received via mailing list)
One disadvantage is that you can hardly ever convince your boss to use
it in the workplace.

On Apr 2, 11:29 pm, Rajdeep Pohanerkar <rails-mailing-l...@andreas-
51e25e353f0a0d2cdfb2e841725a72c1?d=identicon&s=25 Rajdeep Pohanerkar (rajrkodeep)
on 2007-04-03 05:37
Sir,i need technical disadvantages
Cf6fbf29db0e0cecd68593c262f72c12?d=identicon&s=25 Jonathan Parker (Guest)
on 2007-04-03 05:41
(Received via mailing list)
As far as I know it doesn't scale out to a webfarm unless I'm wrong and
there is a way of maintaining the session in a database.
3726bda7f0d852f7e8296fb0d69aa9e0?d=identicon&s=25 Andy Triboletti (Guest)
on 2007-04-03 05:48
(Received via mailing list)
One of its disadvantages is the lack of complete documentation
online.  (Books help) Some of the generated rubydocs will just
contain the name of the method and nothing else  (compared to php.net/
your-function-name-here with lots of user comments and tutorials) or
the javadocs from sun.  For instance try to find some documentation
on how the post, get or head shortcuts work and what parameters they
accept in rails.

Andy
0ab6a5abab167b409f58d280dc59a229?d=identicon&s=25 Faisal N Jawdat (Guest)
on 2007-04-03 06:00
(Received via mailing list)
On Apr 2, 2007, at 11:39 PM, Jonathan Parker wrote:
> As far as I know it doesn't scale out to a webfarm unless I'm wrong

it does, but it costs.  ruby is, relative to other languages, slow.
rails has a lot of techniques to compensate for that slowness in most
scenarios.  however, those techniques involve more resources.

between jruby and yarv the speed issue is likely to go away in the
next couple years.  also, consider your deployment scenario to know
if this limitation is actually a legitimate concern.

> and there is a way of maintaining the session in a database.

use the activerecord store

-faisal
8310c5a7c769345114597bcdef111488?d=identicon&s=25 Ben Munat (Guest)
on 2007-04-03 06:08
(Received via mailing list)
Jonathan Parker wrote:
 > As far as I know it doesn't scale out to a webfarm unless I'm wrong
 > and there is a way of maintaining the session in a database.
 >

In environment.rb:

# Use the database for sessions instead of the file system
# (create the session table with 'rake db:sessions:create')
config.action_controller.session_store = :active_record_store

config.action_controller.session = { :session_key => "_my_session_id",
             :secret => "some secret phrase" }

Voila... sessions in the db.

b
F5d61a3c93217e393cfdf7bf5c7ac628?d=identicon&s=25 Michael D. Ivey (Guest)
on 2007-04-03 06:08
(Received via mailing list)
On Apr 2, 2007, at 10:39 PM, Jonathan Parker wrote:
> As far as I know it doesn't scale out to a webfarm unless I'm wrong
> and there is a way of maintaining the session in a database.

You can scale to a webfarm, and put sessions in the DB or memcache or
turn them off or all kinds of things.

Rails scales very nicely to multiple server environments.
91a296784a35bb4efb6221abc282127d?d=identicon&s=25 Adam Greene (Guest)
on 2007-04-04 00:07
(Received via mailing list)
Because rails is the hot commodity right now, it can be difficult to
find developers.  People are learning as quickly as they can, but a
good rails programmer, if you can find one, will cost.

cheers!
Adam
F5d61a3c93217e393cfdf7bf5c7ac628?d=identicon&s=25 Michael D. Ivey (Guest)
on 2007-04-04 00:15
(Received via mailing list)
On Apr 3, 2007, at 5:05 PM, Adam Greene wrote:
> a good rails programmer, if you can find one, will cost.

This is true of any language.  Good programmers cost money.

Is it a disadvantage that there aren't a bunch of bad Rails
programmers yet?  That's debatable, but I don't think so.
52cb4115a870ff1942e7e1ae96f4306f?d=identicon&s=25 Tyler MacDonald (Guest)
on 2007-04-04 00:27
(Received via mailing list)
Michael D. Ivey <michael.ivey@gmail.com> wrote:
> > a good rails programmer, if you can find one, will cost.
> This is true of any language.  Good programmers cost money.
>
> Is it a disadvantage that there aren't a bunch of bad Rails
> programmers yet?  That's debatable, but I don't think so.

   I think the assertion that there aren't a bunch of bad Rails
programmers
yet is debatable. ;-)

  - Tyler
D3fc5887a2f39f2e0c8989d39ce5e6f9?d=identicon&s=25 Bharat Ruparel (bruparel)
on 2007-04-04 00:43
One potential constraint that you may need to consider is that it may
not fit very well in an existing 'enterprise' architecture with all
kinds of rules and regulations.  For example, certain big companies have
policies such as using stored procedures to access databases and to use
certain naming conventions for table/field names etc.  Under such
circumstances, Rails will begin to loose its magic since it relies on
"convension over configuration" and automatically reflects on the
underlying table/field structure to dynamically create ActiveRecord
constructs.

Another constraint that you may want to think of is the Security.  There
are well established tools/libraries/techniques in corporate environment
that have leveraged C++/Java for a long time.  Ruby/Rails is just too
new and a bit immature to be able to challenge them yet.  Though, will
JRuby looming on horiozon, you should be able to mix-and-match at least
in theory.

A similar argument can be made for a two phase commit requirement.

Now, you have to balance all this in practice.  How often do you need
aforementioned features?  Most people overestimate that.  On the other
hand, in a financial services environment, e.g. banking, such features
are critical requirements and cannot be compromised upon.  That will
still be the turf of C++/Java/J2EE.

That is just my opinion at this point, but I must admit, I do not have a
lot of Ruby/Rails construction/deployment experience yet.  In Java/J2EE,
I do.  Therefore, someone with more experience/knowledge of Ruby/RoR can
easily challenge it.  That is all right.  We all learn from listening
and being challenged.

Regards,

Bharat
139a2a2f6b330cc59a8dc6384bbf8837?d=identicon&s=25 Corey Konrad (ckonrad)
on 2007-04-04 03:25
Rajdeep Pohanerkar wrote:
> can anyone tell that what are the disadvantages f Ruby on Rails lets
> Discuss

Its hard to say because you arent telling us what kind of project you
are doing with it. I mean i was going to use rails to make an
emcommercer site because i heard that it was quick and easy to get set
up etc, but i found this
https://www.godaddy.com/gdshop/ecommerce/cart.asp?ci which works much
better for what i need and requires no programming or technical skills
at all.
A45f650cce5746dd89aafb3176b47b02?d=identicon&s=25 DyingToLearn (Guest)
on 2007-04-04 04:02
(Received via mailing list)
On Apr 3, 3:25 pm, Tyler MacDonald <google....@crackerjack.net> wrote:
> Michael D. Ivey <michael.i...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > a good rails programmer, if you can find one, will cost.
> > This is true of any language.  Good programmers cost money.
>
> > Is it a disadvantage that there aren't a bunch of bad Rails
> > programmers yet?  That's debatable, but I don't think so.
>
>    I think the assertion that there aren't a bunch of bad Rails programmers
> yet is debatable. ;-)
I'm a bad Rails programmer! (thought I'm trying to change that)
A84d51d60791f8e0fb6d27a8a8b2a96e?d=identicon&s=25 Neil Wilson (neilw)
on 2007-04-04 08:29
(Received via mailing list)
It is so nice to use that it makes your day job seem an even more
depressing.waste of time than it did before.

Seriously though Rails does have its weak spots. In no particular
order I see them as

- Creating 'Forms and Reports' applications seems much more long
winded than it should do. The 'view' part of Rails simply hasn't got
any meat on the bones. Despite RJS, etc you still find yourself
messing around in HTML and CSS at a very low level.

- Using resources, as opposed to providing them, seems a lot more
difficult than it should be. I feel that the interactive part of an
application should simply be consuming REST resources provided by
other facilities (on the same box or elsewhere), but it is just seems
very difficult to do that in Rails at the moment.

- Infrastructure support for Rails is still poor. There is no qucik
way of setting something up that handles backups and restarts
efficienctly and manages traffic into your site so that it doesn't get
Slashdotted.

- Some Rails techniques out there are bad for your application's
health. For example overuse of storage in the session, and lumping all
users in the same database. This all comes from the Rails Tutorials
which have become 'best practice' despite the fact that they were
never intended to be so.

- The documentation and ideas about Rails are scattered around the
Internet on blog sites, with very little consolidation. Blogs may be
easy to use, but they are the worst sort of knowledge store. The
central wiki is an appalling mess that desperately needs a good clear
out.

But despite all that, it is worth sticking with because Rails is so
damn nice to use.

(And if anybody has suggestions has to how to alleviate the pain of
the above, please let me know).

NeilW

On Apr 3, 4:29 am, Rajdeep Pohanerkar <rails-mailing-l...@andreas-
F591ddfdb8280c001a7f2d5a13fa0c2c?d=identicon&s=25 keith (Guest)
on 2007-04-04 16:03
(Received via mailing list)
One of the reasons we chose to go with RoR for our current projects is
that we figured there would be a greater concentration of good
programmers that know RoR as supposed to Java.  That has turned out to
be the case so far.

There are a couple good free sights for posting Ruby job
requistions.

rubydc.com (DC only obviously)
http://jobs.rubynow.com/
and you can't beat a $25 craigslist posting
7572157852143be53747b2d08784cb6f?d=identicon&s=25 Jeff Barczewski (Guest)
on 2007-04-04 16:28
(Received via mailing list)
On 4/4/07, Neil Wilson <aldursys@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> - Creating 'Forms and Reports' applications seems much more long
> winded than it should do. The 'view' part of Rails simply hasn't got
> any meat on the bones. Despite RJS, etc you still find yourself
> messing around in HTML and CSS at a very low level.


> (And if anybody has suggestions has to how to alleviate the pain of
> the above, please let me know).
>
>

MasterView is a gem/plugin for Ruby on Rails which allows you to create
views that you can WYSIWYG edit them and not have to fiddle directly
with
HTML and CSS as much. Use tools like the open source NVU or Dreamweaver
to
do the editing (even give this to a designer to work on). And these new
views, retain all the nice features of rails including layouts,
partials,
and use of helpers. You can start from an html prototype and make it
real or
use the built in generator to get you a CRUD set of views set up.

We have a demo of the second usage up on the website here

http://masterview.org/videos/demo_short.html

Main site: http://masterview.org/
Rubyforge project: http://rubyforge.org/projects/masterview

If you have any questions about the project or its focus, send them my
way.

Jeff


--
Jeff Barczewski, MasterView core team
Inspired Horizons Ruby on Rails Training and Consultancy
http://inspiredhorizons.com/
C6b3fb1b16a9878bc793a90bdc1c9799?d=identicon&s=25 Hema Gonaboina (hema_mca)
on 2009-01-23 07:02
Hi,
    I am a developer on Ruby on Rails from 6 months...
    We developed Rails application using the Apache(Configured with
mongrel) server,the problem is we are developing a integrated generic
application where the application is one,clients are many so on the same
server many users can access the application.We are facing the
performance issue.When multiple users accessing the application it is
working very dead slow since it having large database and lot of
different functionalities ...
    Is there any way to increase the performance?





Jeff Barczewski wrote:
> On 4/4/07, Neil Wilson <aldursys@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> - Creating 'Forms and Reports' applications seems much more long
>> winded than it should do. The 'view' part of Rails simply hasn't got
>> any meat on the bones. Despite RJS, etc you still find yourself
>> messing around in HTML and CSS at a very low level.
>
>
>> (And if anybody has suggestions has to how to alleviate the pain of
>> the above, please let me know).
>>
>>
>
> MasterView is a gem/plugin for Ruby on Rails which allows you to create
> views that you can WYSIWYG edit them and not have to fiddle directly
> with
> HTML and CSS as much. Use tools like the open source NVU or Dreamweaver
> to
> do the editing (even give this to a designer to work on). And these new
> views, retain all the nice features of rails including layouts,
> partials,
> and use of helpers. You can start from an html prototype and make it
> real or
> use the built in generator to get you a CRUD set of views set up.
>
> We have a demo of the second usage up on the website here
>
> http://masterview.org/videos/demo_short.html
>
> Main site: http://masterview.org/
> Rubyforge project: http://rubyforge.org/projects/masterview
>
> If you have any questions about the project or its focus, send them my
> way.
>
> Jeff
>
>
> --
> Jeff Barczewski, MasterView core team
> Inspired Horizons Ruby on Rails Training and Consultancy
> http://inspiredhorizons.com/
6b10f051409f8fd3498dbfa681932ae0?d=identicon&s=25 Alex Conner (Guest)
on 2009-01-23 15:50
(Received via mailing list)
Could you give us some numbers, like the actual hardware you're using
and the number of clients?

Right off I can think of a couple of things, like obviously making
sure you're running Mongrel in Production mode and making use of
Caching.  There are a ton of different Rails performance tools
available including FiveRuns TuneUp and NewRelic.

With some real numbers, we can probably throw out some real ideas.

On Jan 23, 1:02 am, Hema Gonaboina <rails-mailing-l...@andreas-s.net>
059ed46172a087063ce26250e44c8627?d=identicon&s=25 Fernando Perez (fernando)
on 2009-01-23 23:35
Alex Conner wrote:
> Could you give us some numbers, like the actual hardware you're using
> and the number of clients?
>
> Right off I can think of a couple of things, like obviously making
> sure you're running Mongrel in Production mode and making use of
> Caching.  There are a ton of different Rails performance tools
> available including FiveRuns TuneUp and NewRelic.
>
> With some real numbers, we can probably throw out some real ideas.
>
> On Jan 23, 1:02�am, Hema Gonaboina <rails-mailing-l...@andreas-s.net>

Don't forget to add the correct indexes to your Database. Please give us
some figures such as number of requests per day and per second, time to
process a request, type of hardware, etc.
7956c3c7d7ef344265029e6b4b569b91?d=identicon&s=25 Huw Collingbourne (huw)
on 2009-01-23 23:42
Jeff Barczewski wrote:

> MasterView is a gem/plugin for Ruby on Rails which allows you to create
> views that you can WYSIWYG edit them and not have to fiddle directly
> with
> HTML and CSS as much. Use tools like the open source NVU or Dreamweaver
> to
> do the editing (even give this to a designer to work on).

Ruby In Steel has a full page, drag-and-drop WYSIWYG visual design
environment for Rails. You can either design the pages inside Ruby In
Steel or you can share them with a dedicated designer such as
Dreamweaver.

More info here:

http://www.sapphiresteel.com/Visual-Rails-Workbenc...
http://www.sapphiresteel.com/A-Brief-Guide-To-The-...
http://www.sapphiresteel.com/A-Brief-Guide-To-The-...

Short screencast here:

http://www.sapphiresteel.com/Visual-Rails-Workbenc...

best wishes
Huw

SapphireSteel Software
http://www.sapphiresteel.com
9a2a53db8e9b4476038c94a64b32833f?d=identicon&s=25 Ryan Bigg (ryan-bigg)
on 2009-01-24 00:22
(Received via mailing list)
Switching over to passenger may help also. You can find it at
http://modrails.com
-----
Ryan Bigg
Freelancer
http://frozenplague.net
047c2e2a6349db15db769e3ad46cf936?d=identicon&s=25 Kumar Saurav (sauravsuman012)
on 2009-01-24 04:13
Rajdeep Pohanerkar wrote:
> can anyone tell that what are the disadvantages f Ruby on Rails lets
> Discuss

I am not a good programmer of ROR but it can be said some times it give
too many problem and random behavior to implement the AJAX Use.
Aafa8848c4b764f080b1b31a51eab73d?d=identicon&s=25 Phlip (Guest)
on 2009-01-24 16:55
(Received via mailing list)
Kumar Saurav wrote:

> I am not a good programmer of ROR but it can be said some times it give
> too many problem and random behavior to implement the AJAX Use.

That is HTML's, your server's, your browser's, and JavaScript's faults.

The best that can be said for Rails here is it gives a good ride
_despite_ all
those impediments!
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