# Why gem built with hoe depends on hoe? **URL:** \ **Category:** Ruby\ **Created:** [February 1, 2008, 2:21pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/why-gem-built-with-hoe-depends-on-hoe/127810 "2008-02-01T14:21:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/p/ba8739/32.png) [@pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/pluskid)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2008, 2:21pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/why-gem-built-with-hoe-depends-on-hoe/127810/1 "2008-02-01T14:21:01Z")
Hi, I find hoe a cool tool to build and release gems. But I find that the gem built with hoe get a dependency to hoe automatically. I think the user will only need to install hoe if he want to build the gem manually. So adding this dependency automatically is unreasonable, isn’t it? Or am I wrong? Is it that the gem built by hoe need hoe to run? Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/p/ba8739/32.png) [@pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/pluskid)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2008, 3:45pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/why-gem-built-with-hoe-depends-on-hoe/127810/2 "2008-02-01T15:45:35Z")
On Feb 1, 2008, at 7:20 AM, pluskid wrote: > Hoe’s gotta eat too! ---
**Author:** ![pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/p/ba8739/32.png) [@pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/pluskid)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2008, 5:12pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/why-gem-built-with-hoe-depends-on-hoe/127810/3 "2008-02-01T17:12:19Z")
On 1 feb, 11:19, pluskid [removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid](mailto:removed_email_address@domain.invalid) wrote: > Hi, > > I find hoe a cool tool to build and release gems. But I find that > the gem built with hoe get a dependency to hoe automatically. > I think the user will only need to install hoe if he want to build > the gem manually. So adding this dependency automatically > is unreasonable, isn’t it? > > Or am I wrong? Is it that the gem built by hoe need hoe to run? > Thanks! The argument behind this is that you can “gem check -t gemname” to run the unit tests for a gem. If the user firing that command don’t have ‘hoe’ installed, will fail due a missing dependency. There is no way to differentiate build, test and runtime environments for RubyGems. Is quite common things like this were asked (I have tracked a mail from 2005 AFAIK). Anyhow, Susan Potter just raised this issue [1]. She is using something interally that could, adapted to mainstream, help everybody in the long run. [1] [http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/rubygems-developers/2008-February/003538.html](http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/rubygems-developers/2008-February/003538.html) ---
**Author:** ![pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/p/ba8739/32.png) [@pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/pluskid)\ **Post date:** [February 1, 2008, 5:15pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/why-gem-built-with-hoe-depends-on-hoe/127810/4 "2008-02-01T17:15:53Z")
On 1 feb, 14:09, Luis L. [removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid](mailto:removed_email_address@domain.invalid) wrote: > […] > > Anyhow, Susan Potter just raised this issue [1]. > > She is using something interally that could, adapted to mainstream, > help everybody in the long run. Wrong link: [1] [http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/rubygems-developers/2008-January/003522.html](http://rubyforge.org/pipermail/rubygems-developers/2008-January/003522.html) ---
**Author:** ![pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/p/ba8739/32.png) [@pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/pluskid)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2008, 7:29am UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/why-gem-built-with-hoe-depends-on-hoe/127810/5 "2008-02-02T07:29:25Z")
Yeah! I see. I think apt-get (of Debian) has done a great job on this topic. It just install all runtime dependencies when you run apt-get install something And it provides an extra command to install the dev dependecies: apt-get build-dep something I think RubyGems have no such features yet, isn’t it? Maybe they can think about similar things. So currently I should think the definition of “dependency” be “dev dependency”. 2008/2/2, Luis L. [removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid](mailto:removed_email_address@domain.invalid): ---
**Author:** ![pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/p/ba8739/32.png) [@pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/pluskid)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2008, 3:52pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/why-gem-built-with-hoe-depends-on-hoe/127810/6 "2008-02-02T15:52:23Z")
On Feb 1, 2008 6:20 AM, pluskid [removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid](mailto:removed_email_address@domain.invalid) wrote: > You should look at Mr Bones. It does the same thing as hoe, but without the viral dependency. sudo gem install bones [http://codeforpeople.rubyforge.org/bones](http://codeforpeople.rubyforge.org/bones) Blessings, TwP ---
**Author:** ![pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/p/ba8739/32.png) [@pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/pluskid)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2008, 4:13pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/why-gem-built-with-hoe-depends-on-hoe/127810/7 "2008-02-03T16:13:46Z")
I use newgem, which sits on top of hoe (and removes it from the deplist). It’s written by Dr. Nic and works really, really well. I haven’t tried Mr Bones. Perhaps I will on my next project… –Jeremy On Feb 3, 2008 9:49 AM, pluskid [removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid](mailto:removed_email_address@domain.invalid) wrote: > > > is unreasonable, isn’t it? > > > > Blessings, > > TwP > > Yeah! It looks great! Even with integrate with rspec. Hmm. I’ll > > investigate it more. Thanks! – [http://www.jeremymcanally.com/](http://www.jeremymcanally.com/) My books: Ruby in Practice > **[Ruby in Practice](https://www.manning.com/books/ruby-in-practice)** > > Like Ruby itself, Ruby in Practice will make you more productive. The book shows you practical techniques and strategies for small projects and large-scale environments. A cookbook-style reference, it gives you concrete examples of systems... My free Ruby e-book > **[Site not found · DreamHost](http://www.humblelittlerubybook.com/)** > > The owner of this domain has not yet uploaded their website. My blogs: > **[Site not found · DreamHost](http://www.mrneighborly.com/)** > > The owner of this domain has not yet uploaded their website. [http://www.rubyinpractice.com/](http://www.rubyinpractice.com/) ---
**Author:** ![pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/p/ba8739/32.png) [@pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/pluskid)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 9:29pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/why-gem-built-with-hoe-depends-on-hoe/127810/8 "2008-02-05T21:29:49Z")
On Feb 2, 2008 6:51 AM, Tim P. [removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid](mailto:removed_email_address@domain.invalid) wrote: > On Feb 1, 2008 6:20 AM, pluskid [removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid](mailto:removed_email_address@domain.invalid) wrote: > You should look at Mr Bones. It does the same thing as hoe, but > without the viral dependency. > > sudo gem install bones On a related note, I wanted to share my own methodology. I’ve got a Monotone branch that I use as the basis of my projects, which includes some starting directories, a Rakefile and a gemspec.rb. As I discover variations and improvements, or adapt to updates of rubygems or rake, I update the project and propagate them automatically out to all the projects based on the branch. I’ve got a couple of tricks that I yionked from hoe in there, and I expect I’ll take a gander at Mr Bones as well. Advantages: - No extra dependencies in the eventual gems. - Improvements to the skeleton can be propagated to projects - without destroying local tweaks for the projects - I have my own control over how I use rake, rubygems, etc. I suppose there’s the disadvantage that it ties me to monotone. I suspect (but am not sure) that a similar thing could be accomplished with git, but probably not with subversion. Judson ---
**Author:** ![pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/p/ba8739/32.png) [@pluskid](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/pluskid)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2008, 3:50pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/why-gem-built-with-hoe-depends-on-hoe/127810/9 "2008-02-03T15:50:40Z")
On Feb 2, 10:51 pm, Tim P. [removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid](mailto:removed_email_address@domain.invalid) wrote: > > Or am I wrong? Is it that the gem built by hoe need hoe to run? > > TwP > > Yeah! It looks great! Even with integrate with rspec. Hmm. I’ll > > investigate it more. Thanks!