# Selling Ruby on Rails to the Masses **URL:** \ **Category:** Rails\ **Created:** [October 30, 2006, 4:31pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/selling-ruby-on-rails-to-the-masses/74114 "2006-10-30T16:31:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/71c47a/32.png) [@bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/bfsog)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2006, 4:31pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/selling-ruby-on-rails-to-the-masses/74114/1 "2006-10-30T16:31:27Z")
I am looking for information about how to sell or pitch the advantages of Ruby On Rails to businesses from a Web D.s stand point I can see the great potential of RoR but I need to list these features so I can then convince other non web developers. Does anyone have any links or resources to share? Please post em. ---
**Author:** ![bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/71c47a/32.png) [@bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/bfsog)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2006, 5:11pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/selling-ruby-on-rails-to-the-masses/74114/2 "2006-10-30T17:11:17Z")
Andrew B. wrote: > I am looking for information about how to sell or pitch the advantages > of Ruby On Rails to businesses from a Web D.s stand point I can > see the great potential of RoR but I need to list these features so I > can then convince other non web developers. > > Does anyone have any links or resources to share? Please post em. Have you seen ‘From Java to Ruby’ (by bruce tate)? As you’d guess it’s only about people moving from java, but the stuff about the advantages of rails should be fairly relevant to people with other backgrounds. Fred ---
**Author:** ![bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/71c47a/32.png) [@bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/bfsog)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2006, 9:33pm UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/selling-ruby-on-rails-to-the-masses/74114/3 "2006-10-30T21:33:25Z")
I’ll take a look thanks ---
**Author:** ![bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/71c47a/32.png) [@bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/bfsog)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2006, 10:46am UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/selling-ruby-on-rails-to-the-masses/74114/4 "2006-11-07T10:46:11Z")
I would just sit back and think of reasons why it makes sense to use rails over something else. If you can’t think of those reasons, maybe you shouldn’t pitch it to your clients just yet. 😃 On 10/30/06, Fred [removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid](mailto:removed_email_address@domain.invalid) wrote: > Have you seen ‘From Java to Ruby’ (by bruce tate)? As you’d guess it’s > only about people moving from java, but the stuff about the advantages > of rails should be fairly relevant to people with other backgrounds. > > Fred > > – > Posted via [http://www.ruby-forum.com/](http://www.ruby-forum.com/). > > > – Chris S. removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid [http://compiledmonkey.wordpress.com](http://compiledmonkey.wordpress.com) ---
**Author:** ![bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/71c47a/32.png) [@bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/bfsog)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2006, 10:47am UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/selling-ruby-on-rails-to-the-masses/74114/5 "2006-11-07T10:47:38Z")
> I am looking for information about how to sell or pitch the advantages > of Ruby On Rails to businesses from a Web D.s stand point I can > see the great potential of RoR but I need to list these features so I > can then convince other non web developers. > > Does anyone have any links or resources to share? Please post em. No links, but the advantage to them is the same as it is to you… just with a ROI slant. - You like Rails because you can developer quicker. - They like Rails because it costs them less cause you can develop quicker. Etc… ---
**Author:** ![bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/71c47a/32.png) [@bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/bfsog)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2006, 10:47am UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/selling-ruby-on-rails-to-the-masses/74114/6 "2006-11-07T10:47:40Z")
On Mon, 30 Oct 2006 16:31:27 +0100 Andrew B. [removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid](mailto:removed_email_address@domain.invalid) wrote: > I am looking for information about how to sell or pitch the advantages > of Ruby On Rails to businesses from a Web D.s stand point I can > see the great potential of RoR but I need to list these features so I > can then convince other non web developers. One thing I would recommend Andrew is, “Never throw pearls before swine.” Meaning, if you are working with or leading a group of developers who are vehemently opposed to any new technology like Ruby, Python, etc. then don’t bother. It’s not worth it to convince them since the threat to their jobs and ego is too much. In my opinion, you’re better off hiring a group of new folks who are interested in learning the new stuff, then a mentor to train them, and then use the previous group as maintainers. Eventually the previous group will either find new jobs, join the new group willingly and eagerly, or be happy to keep the old systems working. I think the best people for this are folks with degrees NOT in computer science who are smart and can already code. My only word of caution is that when the old timers join the new group you’ve got to watch for saboteurs. I actually worked on a project where a new sysadmin got caught purposefully crashing our servers. He at first was just killing the processes and changing file permissions (Samhain is your friend), then him and other sysadmin friends would just walk over to the box and turn it off. I worked with another guy that would spend all his free time finding flaws in RoR and then come to work ranting about them or demanding we use these features so he could demonstrate how screwed up they are. So just watch out for this. It happens a lot more often than you think, and many times it’s just not worth going to the trouble to use possible saboteurs. Hope that helps. – Zed A. Shaw, MUDCRAP-CE Master Black Belt Sifu > **[Zed A. shaw](https://zedshaw.com/)** > > Personal essays and writings by Zed A. Shaw. [O'Reilly Media - Technology and Business Training](http://safari.oreilly.com/0321483502) – The Mongrel Book [http://mongrel.rubyforge.org/](http://mongrel.rubyforge.org/) [http://www.lingr.com/room/3yXhqKbfPy8](http://www.lingr.com/room/3yXhqKbfPy8) – Come get help. ---
**Author:** ![bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/71c47a/32.png) [@bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/bfsog)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2006, 10:51am UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/selling-ruby-on-rails-to-the-masses/74114/7 "2006-11-07T10:51:39Z")
@Zed: That’s really great advice and extremely well-put. I’ve seen that stuff before too and it’s not fun at all. IT is a changing industry, and it’s so strange to me that people resist change. The real test for us is to be willing to adapt when RoR is replaced by something better. (!!GASP!!) ---
**Author:** ![bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/71c47a/32.png) [@bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/bfsog)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2006, 10:51am UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/selling-ruby-on-rails-to-the-masses/74114/8 "2006-11-07T10:51:12Z")
> "_Selling Ruby on Rails to the Masses"_ Do the masses need Ruby On Rails? The scenarios Zed describes are not uncommon any time a new technology appears and sometimes you might save yourself a lot of heartache if you just keep it to yourself until the Old Guard retires or dies. Or, you can work a few hours a week on your own time and develop something that _shows_ them why you think Rails is the way to go… if it works, great. If not, and you’re still stuck on the idea, start looking for a new place to work, somewhere you’ll be happier. (Better yet, work for yourself.) Just for perspective: this battle has been going on forever. Starry-eyed hippie engineers would get hired right out of college babbling about some fancy new language called ‘C’ or ‘C++’ or something equally absurd, and the Fortran and COBOL and Lisp guys would feel The Fear - if this new technology became a focus, they’d either have to learn this strange new language or face becoming irrelevant. And the new hires, to whom the new language Just Made Sense, were left wondering where all of the hostility and resistance to change was coming from. Now those same guys are staring at you wondering where you get your crazy ideas. -foobario One thing I would recommend Andrew is, “Never throw pearls before swine.” ---
**Author:** ![bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/71c47a/32.png) [@bfsog](https://www.ruby-forum.com/u/bfsog)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2006, 10:52am UTC](https://www.ruby-forum.com/t/selling-ruby-on-rails-to-the-masses/74114/9 "2006-11-07T10:52:04Z")
> -----Original Message----- > From: removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid > [[mailto:removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid](mailto:removed_email_address@domain.invalid)] On Behalf Of Zed A. Shaw > Sent: Monday, October 30, 2006 3:55 PM > To: removed\_email\_address@domain.invalid > Subject: [Rails] Re: Selling Ruby on Rails to the Masses > My only word of caution is that when the old timers join the > new group you’ve got to watch for saboteurs. I actually > worked on a project where a new sysadmin got caught > purposefully crashing our servers. He at first was just > killing the processes and changing file permissions (Samhain > is your friend), then him and other sysadmin friends would > just walk over to the box and turn it off. Wow, I’d love to hear more about this. They did this because they felt the new project/technology threatened their jobs, or did they have other motivations? > I worked with another guy that would spend all his free time > finding flaws in RoR and then come to work ranting about them > or demanding we use these features so he could demonstrate > how screwed up they are. What happened to this guy? What was his preferred platform (if any)? > So just watch out for this. It happens a lot more often than > you think, and many times it’s just not worth going to the > trouble to use possible saboteurs. You’re scaring me Zed. - Dan This communication is the property of Qwest and may contain confidential or privileged information. Unauthorized use of this communication is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this communication in error, please immediately notify the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of the communication and any attachments.