Caveat: this is not a discussion about *hosting* a rails app on windows. Anyway...Macs are everywhere you look when researching rails (demo vids, tutorials, and pictures from rails training classes). I'm interested in what the pros to using a Mac for rails development are (besides textmate). Is it more of a cultural thing, a what would 37 signals do thing, is it a unix thing, or something else...
on 2006-05-20 00:06
on 2006-05-20 00:12
On Friday, May 19, 2006, at 4:05 PM, Nathan P. Verni wrote: > > >_______________________________________________ >Rails mailing list >firstname.lastname@example.org >http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails > I recently switched to a mac for development because. 1. you can run nearly everything on it. With bootcamp and parallels, you can run windows too. This makes cross-platform testing on a single machine possible. 2. its fundamentally a *nix machine, which gives you some nice tools to work with. 3. You can't get textmate on a PC. 4. peer pressure The only thing I miss is TortoiseSVN. _Kevin
on 2006-05-20 00:19
> The only thing I miss is TortoiseSVN. Seconded. I prefer development on my Mac hands down, but I find myself at the command line doing svn commit, svn status, etc... Tortoise is a really great tool for subversion. ~ Ben On 19 May 2006 20:10:54 -0000, Kevin O. <email@example.com> wrote: > >thing, is it a unix thing, or something else... > 1. you can run nearly everything on it. With bootcamp and parallels, > -- > Posted with http://DevLists.com. Sign up and save your mailbox. > _______________________________________________ > Rails mailing list > firstname.lastname@example.org > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails > -- Ben R. 303-947-0446 http://www.benr75.com
on 2006-05-20 00:22
Have you looked at svnX? http://www.lachoseinteractive.net/en/community/sub... On May 19, 2006, at 1:16 PM, Ben R. wrote: >> >> >what the pros to using a Mac for rails development are (besides >> > >> 4. peer pressure >> > - Bill
on 2006-05-20 00:25
On Friday, May 19, 2006, at 1:22 PM, Bill P. wrote: >> myself at the command line doing svn commit, svn status, etc... >>> > >>> > >>> you can run windows too. This makes cross-platform testing on a >>> >> Ben R. >- Bill > >_______________________________________________ >Rails mailing list >email@example.com >http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails That is what I'm using now, but it's just not as easy (or as fast) as TortoiseSVN. _Kevin
on 2006-05-20 00:28
I found svnX to be acceptable. I set things up on the command line but use svnX to commit, update, add etc. http://www.lachoseinteractive.net/en/community/sub... On 5/19/06, Ben R. <firstname.lastname@example.org> wrote: > > > > > > > you can run windows too. This makes cross-platform testing on a single > > Posted with http://DevLists.com. Sign up and save your mailbox. > http://www.benr75.com > _______________________________________________ > Rails mailing list > email@example.com > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails > --
on 2006-05-20 00:32
Kevin O. wrote: > On Friday, May 19, 2006, at 4:05 PM, Nathan P. Verni wrote: > 3. You can't get textmate on a PC. > > The only thing I miss is TortoiseSVN. In my copy of TextMate, control-shift-A brings up a list of subversion commands I can choose from. I only use a shell for the less-common ones. --Al Evans
on 2006-05-20 04:11
Hi, I'm going to switch to a Mac (probably the Mac Mini - cost about $800) -- any advice on the hardware/software/OS/Disk configuration and I'll be connecting to a cable modem. I'm going to be doing Web D. using RoR and MySQL. Cheers, Pat
on 2006-05-20 04:19
My advices: dont get the ram from Apple! Buy it from elsewhere and upgrade it yourself, you will save some cash. Also, make sure you have at least 1gig. Get an external HD, preferably FW sicne it is faster and will spare the CPU. Personnaly, I would get wireless internet and mouse/keyboard just because I hate cables. Software to get: Textmate and CSSEdit. Two great software and must for every webdev! There are a lot of accessories made by third parties for the mini, look around! You should also consider the new macbook, they cost a bit more but are way faster and cooler! And welcome to the mac community!
on 2006-05-20 04:23
Hey Pat, I would recommend getting a new MacBook if you're need portability. Peace, -Conrad
on 2006-05-20 04:38
Thank you for the good advice...I will take it. I hope I can return the favor someday. Cheers, Pat
on 2006-05-20 04:44
No. This will not require much from your hardware. If you want to use java based IDE or anything like that you might want to get at least 1gb of ram since Java is a big memory hogger. I'm mostly developing on a 12" PowerBookG4 with 512 mb ram. It's works fine. I have the standard Textmate, Safari, iTerm and DarwinPorts setup. If you get a Mac Mini or a MacBook now you will have at least 2 times faster computer so you should be ok. On 5/20/06, Pat L. <firstname.lastname@example.org> wrote: > From: email@example.com > Tortoise is a really great tool for subversion. > > > > > > > single > > -- > 303-947-0446 > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails > --
on 2006-05-20 04:47
Good evening Conrad, I'm planning on implementing three applications using RoR. I'll take a look at MacBook, but I really like the Mac Mini. What do you think would be a good configuration - ie OSX, Tiger, External Hard Drive, memory. I currently have a LinkSys router but I'm going to go with a wireless router (to connect to my cable modem) - I'm also looking at a wireless mouse and keyboard. I need the external hard drive for backups. Good weekend, Pat
on 2006-05-20 04:50
Hey Nathan, your question is like asking what are the pros to developing .net on windows. Anyway, here are the pros to developing Rails on Mac OS X: 1) Mac OS X 2) Unix based (FreeBSD + Mach Kernel) 3) Many Unix and Commercial Applications 4) It's the BEST commerical OS out there with the best hardware to go along with it. 5) Wasn't Ruby and Rails born in the Unix environment? If so, then this is another reason. Peace, -Conrad
on 2006-05-20 04:50
Hey Pat, if you're buying RAM, don't get the less quality stuff to save a buck. You can save money by going outside of Apple but you want to look for the same quality of RAM. Peace, -Conrad
on 2006-05-20 04:54
No more Java or ASP.Net for me...I've really 'fallen in love' with RoR. I'm planning on putting up three applications using it and MySql, wish me luck. I'm currently going thru the 'Pick Axe' book and the 'AWDWR' book and for the first time in a long time, I'm really having a ball... Good weekend and thanks for the advice. Pat
on 2006-05-20 05:06
Hey Pat, the black MacBook looks GREAT. I saw it and simply said, "WOW...". Thus, I would highly look at getting a MacBook because you can add an external monitor when you're at home but allows you to be mobile as well. For example, your clients would like you to come to the office; laptop for demostration. I would recommend the following development environment: o MacBook (Mac OS X comes installed) o Max out the memory to 2 GB o Get a network external harddrive o LinkSys router is good a) connect the networt drive to the router o Add an AirPort Express for wireless (printing and connectivity to internet) Peace, -Conrad
on 2006-05-20 06:34
> 4. peer pressure I'm going to go against the grain here. I've done the textmate thing. Looks nice, but well, it's *just* a text editor (ducks for cover). If you want full integration of your workflow go no further than RadRails + Subclipse. In IDE versioning of your files, code assist, data navigator, rails generators etc etc etc. It's nice and has a lot of promise for the future for where it's going. My preference is actually WinXP (even though I can have either, it's my preference). Maybe as I've lived on XP for so long.. and that desktop gui performance just feels way more snappier than OSX. At work, it's full time RadRails work on OSX (Tiger). At home it's Windows + RadRails + PuTTY for managing servers, or Suse 10.1 which I'm trying to get some love for to feel better about my open source self. OS X can be a right royal PITA for getting stuff compiled and working on it, you'll find some stuff just doesn't work as advertised (eg compiling graphicsmagick via darwinports). I'd far prefer to manage a *nix box via PuTTY and keep windows for development. That fantastic thing about Rails is you can run it on windows without any pain. That's my experience at any rate. Rowan
on 2006-05-20 07:05
Pat L. wrote: > Hi, > I'm going to switch to a Mac (probably the Mac Mini - cost about $800) > -- any advice on the hardware/software/OS/Disk configuration and I'll be > connecting to a cable modem. I'm going to be doing Web D. using > RoR and MySQL. > Cheers, > Pat The mini is great. I have one for doing some cross-platform development. Downside is that it can't drive two monitors. I don't know how the hell anyone gets stuff done with just one monitor. Jake
on 2006-05-20 07:13
Hey Rowan, I haven't had any troubles compiling any of those things that you mentioned. Also, I don't have to go through the trouble of installing another OS as in Suse 10.1 or another application like Putty. It comes standard out of the box. However, I do agree with you in regards to RadRails and that it has alot of promise. Furthermore, I can create my own Rails tutorial videos, create podcasts, and make this available to the Rails community. In Mac OS X, it simply works. Peace, -Conrad
on 2006-05-20 07:16
Conrad T. wrote: > Hey Nathan, your question is like asking what are the pros to developing > .net on windows. Anyway, here are the pros to developing Rails on Mac > OS X: > > 1) Mac OS X > 2) Unix based (FreeBSD + Mach Kernel) > 3) Many Unix and Commercial Applications > 4) It's the BEST commerical OS out there with the best hardware > to go along with it. > 5) Wasn't Ruby and Rails born in the Unix environment? If so, then > this is another reason. > > Peace, > > -Conrad Not to start a fight here, but none of these justify "developing Rails" on a Mac. They may argue Mac over PC.... but... Here are my arguments that it doesn't matter: 1. Webrick runs on Mac and Windows just fine. 2. Eclipse / RadRails runs on both just fine. 3. SVN runs on both just fine. +Windows - TortoiseSVN is great. 4. +Mac - TextMate, though I haven't bought into that myself yet. 5. Ruby runs on both just fine -- therefore you get the generators, Capistrano, etc. Simple fact is that I do lots of other stuff on a computer. Most of that stuff (in my case) makes it more reasonable to stick with a PC. I really enjoy using the Mac, but I'm not going to force that decision. If you already have a PC and are comfortable on it, I think it would be silly to change horses. Both platforms have their quirks. A Mac will not make your application any better. Jake
on 2006-05-20 07:28
Exactly and if you're comfortable on a PC then you needn't fall for the peer pressure thing :) Too many religious nerdy internet flame wars can start over this debate. I was just chucking my 2c worth in the ring that windows is very viable for development on. Maybe in a year or two's time with OS X I may be one of those uber-nerdy nix cli proficient dudes that I'm more productive under OSX, but (again for me), I'm happier under windows and that = more productive. All the tools I use are the same if not better under windows so that makes sense for me. Where I *do* see benefit is under really tricky little shell scripts managing your servers rsyncing/scping all those little bitty files etc. But if you're doing all the you likely wouldn't be needing to ask the question :) R
on 2006-05-20 08:05
hey Jake, you can work with whatever platform you feel comfortable with but please don't ask questions why people use one platform over another. If the developer writes X on a platform, then don't expect it to be on every other platform. Next, those were my reasons for enjoying development on Mac OS X and it's not your reason to switch. I have alot of Unix tools that I'll never see native on the XP platform and most wouldn't work anyways because of the way that XP poorly does memory management and I have been assured that these things will be resolved by MS Support with Windows Vista. Finally, I do alot of video editing with Final Cut Pro, compositing with Shake, and animation work with Maya and these applications either don't exist and/or don't run well with XP. Peace, -Conrad
on 2006-05-20 08:57
The Mini is great, but go for a portable instead. 2.5 years ago I thought I was the last person to get a portable. I had computers everywhere I worked, so why would I need one? I bought it because I was traveling. Now I'm no longer traveling as much, but there's NO WAY I'd go back to a desktop system. Having all of your stuff where ever you are is fantastic. -- -- Tom M.
on 2006-05-20 09:45
The little bitty files etc. are part and parcel of that annoying development thing. rsync and scp are important tools and supported spottily under Windows. If you are deploying to a Windows server, it makes sense to run Windows. If you are deploying to a *nix server, you will run into problems -- probably with permissions -- that you simply couldn't have foreseen. And it will happen exactly when you promised to show the app to your client. I've developed happily on Windows for years. I know how to make Windows run from the command line. Heck, I even know the #@$& PC BIOS. But I still develop Web apps that target *nix platforms on a Mac. I've just been bitten too many times by the "I'm going to just make one little change here..." bug that leaves a permission bit unset on the server and you know the rest. Of course with Bootcamp and Parallel, you don't have to make a choice, do you? That's my $.02 :) -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/OS+for+rails+development%3A+... Sent from the RubyOnRails Users forum at Nabble.com.
on 2006-05-21 00:07
I'm in the process of switching my development over to osx. So far the experience has been great, and I feel like it's a step forward. Unfortunately there are still a few pretty big annoyances. 1. The key bindings that I use the most don't exist. No control arrow to jump between words, or home/end for lines. Textmate can be configured for them to work, but I'm having a hard time getting around everything else without them. 2. No tortoise svn. There's a port (http://scplugin.tigris.org/), but it's inactive, and hasn't been built for intel chips. 3. Navicat for osx sucks comapred to the windows version. 4. No split panes in textmate.
on 2006-05-21 00:22
On 5/20/06, Joshua B. <firstname.lastname@example.org> wrote: > I'm in the process of switching my development over to osx. > So far the experience has been great, and I feel like it's a step forward. > Unfortunately there are still a few pretty big annoyances. > > 1. The key bindings that I use the most don't exist. No control arrow to > jump between words, or home/end for lines. > Textmate can be configured for them to work, but I'm having a hard time > getting around everything else without them. Well.. In my textmate I am able to switch between words by holding down ALT and using the arrows. Going to end of line is done with CTRL and arrows keys. > > 2. No tortoise svn. There's a port (http://scplugin.tigris.org/ ), but it's > inactive, and hasn't been built for intel chips. svnX is nowhere close to being as good as Tortoise. But the only thing I use really is add, commit and update. And svnX is fast and snappy. I at least have found it to be prefectly acceptable > > 3. Navicat for osx sucks comapred to the windows version. You have to realise that switching between operating system means that you can't use excactly the same software. As far as to mysql goes then I firmly believe that you don't need much software for it. I think it's best to learn to use migrations to fully use the power of RoR. Nevertheless it's nice to have a mysql client for when you need to delete many rows or make minor changes. But in that I prefer simplicity over features so I am absolutely in love with yourSQL. More SQL clients: http://www.versiontracker.com/php/search.php?mode=... > > 4. No split panes in textmate. Totally agree. But the great diff support minimized my need for it. > > _______________________________________________ > Rails mailing list > email@example.com > http://lists.rubyonrails.org/mailman/listinfo/rails > > > --
on 2006-05-21 05:14
The key bindings issue is one you will either have to solve by remapping (and TextMate observes these remappings quite well) or by learning the Mac standard keys. After using Windows and only Windows since 3.0, I got a Mac in '97 but used Macs only for graphics. I switched my Web development over to the Mac full time only in the last five months -- I'm really not using the PC anymore except for testing. What's weird is that I so completely retrained myself that it seems as strange to do all the Windows key combinations now as it did when I first started using the Mac key mappings. I've tried Navicat for the Mac and it just wasn't made-for-Mac software. Try CocoaMySQL. http://cocoamysql.sourceforge.net Oh, and please consider migrations instead of the GUI. They are so much more powerful because you can run the migration and test it on you dev machine, then run the exact same migration on your staging and/or production server. And yeah, split panes would be a great feature for TM. -- View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/OS+for+rails+development%3A+... Sent from the RubyOnRails Users forum at Nabble.com.
on 2006-05-21 05:23
Mac vs. Windows vs. BSD/Linux This seems like a wiki topic. It's only a stub http://wiki.rubyonrails.org/rails/pages/Developmen...
on 2006-05-21 19:09
Thanks Conrad.I'll take a look at it.I'm going to make a purchase in June.
on 2006-05-21 19:22
Tom, Thanks for the advice...I'll take a look at the portable...I'm planning on making a purchase in June. Good week, Pat
on 2006-05-21 21:34
On 21 May 2006, at 03:11, s.ross wrote: > the PC anymore except for testing. What's weird is that I so > completely > retrained myself that it seems as strange to do all the Windows key > combinations now as it did when I first started using the Mac key > mappings. > > I've tried Navicat for the Mac and it just wasn't made-for-Mac > software. Try > CocoaMySQL. > > http://cocoamysql.sourceforge.net If you plan on using the latest version of MySQL, I believe you need to use the latest beta (I'm using it with success): http:// cocoamysql.sourceforge.net/beta/CocoaMySQL_0.7b3.zip Best regards Peter De Berdt
on 2006-05-24 01:23
Hmm... considering the switch... So what are the keyboard shortcuts when editing text (in any standard text window not just under text mate under OS X) for 1. Select word 2. Delete a word (Backwards and forwards) 3. Move the cursor to the end of a line or the start 4. Move the cursor jumping per word Is there something you can get for OS X to provide these sort of keyboard shortcuts? It would seem ODD that they left this out of the standard OS feature set since entering text is a common thing.
on 2006-05-24 01:36
On May 23, 2006, at 05:16 PM, Jason wrote: > Hmm... considering the switch... > > So what are the keyboard shortcuts when editing text (in any > standard text > window not just under text mate under OS X) for There's no guarantee that all OS X text editors will follow these short cuts, although the vast majority of them do. For all apps that use the Cocoa text editing features, you get these automatically. > 1. Select word Cursor at start of word: shift + right-arrow Cursor at end of word: shift + left-arrow > 2. Delete a word (Backwards and forwards) Backwards: cmd (aka. "open apple") + delete/backspace (depending on your keyboard labels) Forwards: cmd + del (the key that's next to home/end on full-size keyboards). This one is really hard to do on most laptop keyboards, since they don't normally have this key... > 3. Move the cursor to the end of a line or the start End: cmd + right-arrow Start: cmd + left-arrow > 4. Move the cursor jumping per word Forwards: option (aka. alt) + right-arrow Backwards: option + left-arrow > Is there something you can get for OS X to provide these sort of > keyboard > shortcuts? It would seem ODD that they left this out of the > standard OS feature > set since entering text is a common thing. I guess I haven't been following this thread closely... who said these keyboard shortcuts where left out? As I mentioned above, these are available, by default, for any app that uses the built-in text editing features of the Cocoa application framework. If the programmer chooses not to use this, that certainly can't be the fault of the OS maker, can it? -Brian
on 2006-05-24 02:26
> Forwards: cmd + del (the key that's next to home/end on full-size > keyboards). This one is really hard to do on most laptop keyboards, > since they don't normally have this key... On my old TiBook, the Del key can be obtained by pressing Fn +Backspace. So it's just one key extra. Best regards Peter De Berdt
on 2006-05-24 02:32
> On my old TiBook, the Del key can be obtained by pressing Fn > +Backspace. So it's just one key extra. Same on my AiBook. My personal favourites are control-k and control-y, though you need to know emacs to know what they do. Sometimes multiple cuts get confusing though... An important thing for Windows users: home and end don't work the same, they skip to the start and end of the document. Use command+left arrow and command+right arrow for this, or control-a and control-e if you like your UNIX. -- Phillip H. http://www.sitharus.com/
on 2006-05-24 02:45
Hey Phillip, these are my favorites being that I'm a long time emacs and xemacs user. Peace, -Conrad
on 2006-05-24 04:00
I use SmartSVN to access my subversion repository. They have both Mac, Windows and Linux clients. I'm on a Windows platform so I use their Win version. I used SmartCVS for the longest time and recently switched to Subversion so I was pleased that they have an SVN version of their client. But as for development of the Rails application itself I use Linux (CentOS). - Brent On 19 May 2006 20:24:51 -0000, Kevin O.