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Joe (Guest)
on 2006-02-05 21:13
Interesting article with lots of comments. Compares J2EE, .Net, PHP
(flexies vs. stiffies...):

http://shiflett.org/archive/190

Joe
softwareengineer 99 (Guest)
on 2006-02-05 22:13
(Received via mailing list)
Joe,

  Thanks for sharing the article. I enjoyed reading it.

  I wish he wouldn't have said:

  "Rails over PHP are probably either not using PHP today or aren't
happy to be using it."

  Because now I have to find time and reply to him as to why someone
with  6 years of PHP/C++/Java enterprise development experience would
leave  PHP in a heart beat.

  I don't agree with many points he makes and have started writing on
the story of why I am migrating to ROR.

  To be a good developer, you need to go with the solution that makes
everyone happy.

  I believe ROR is the language for "flexies" and "stiffies" as he puts
it. And I am very new to ROR, but with years of extensive development
experience in C++, Java, PHP, BASH and Perl.

  Years ago, I ditched Java for C++, then moved to PHP for pretty much
the same reasons. How can I get most done with least amount of time and
keep my client and myself happy?

  I plan to post my detailed response to his article within a week.

  Thanks
  Frank
  [ROR stole me from PHP and I ain't going back]

Joe <removed_email_address@domain.invalid> wrote:  Interesting article with lots 
of comments.
Compares J2EE, .Net, PHP
(flexies vs. stiffies...):

http://shiflett.org/archive/190

Joe

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Bill K. (Guest)
on 2006-02-05 22:19
(Received via mailing list)
Yeah, that article doesn't make much sense to me. The author needed to
define his terms. What does he mean by "flexibility and power" and why
would
he ever put PHP in that category and exile Ruby on Rails to the
organized
camp with J2EE and .NET?

It's true that some Rails programmers aren't happy to be using PHP. Why
use
PHP if you can use Ruby? The few reasons I see would be if you needed
lots
of functionality already provided by PHP packages, and you didn't think
it
was a problem creating a frankenstein with those parts.
-Bill
Kevin O. (Guest)
on 2006-02-05 22:25
After reading that article, I will agree on one thing.  RoR does enforce
structure, and I suppose that makes us 'stiffies'.

However, I have often found that there is nothing quite as liberating as
constraints.

_Kevin
Joe (Guest)
on 2006-02-05 22:32
Kevin O. wrote:
> After reading that article, I will agree on one thing.  RoR does enforce
> structure, and I suppose that makes us 'stiffies'.
>
> However, I have often found that there is nothing quite as liberating as
> constraints.
>
> _Kevin

I agree, as opposed to spending loads of time getting lost way out in
left field with PHP which gives you all the rope you need to hang
yourself.

I definitely fall into the "aren't happy to be using [PHP]" camp. I
haven't yet found a single reason to prefer it over Ruby/Rails.

Joe
Dean W. (Guest)
on 2006-02-06 02:39
(Received via mailing list)
On 2/5/06, Kevin O. <removed_email_address@domain.invalid> wrote:
> ...
>
> However, I have often found that there is nothing quite as liberating as
> constraints.
> ...

There's actually real "science" to back this up. A book came out a few
years back called "Design Rules, Vol. 1. The Power of Modularity", by
Carliss Baldwin and Kim Clark. It discusses how well-designed
"platforms" with specific design constraints promote modularity and
create a framework for innovation. They used the computer industry as
an example, where the mostly-open architecture of the PC made it
possible for 3rd-party innovators to create new and better components
that drove performance up and costs down. CPUs themselves became
modular designs, permitting the incredible density that they have
today. It seems paradoxical that constraints can be liberating, but
they eliminate wasted repetition (think of the rails scaffolding) so
that effort can be spent on real innovation.

dean
--
Dean W.
http://www.aspectprogramming.com
http://www.newaspects.com
http://www.contract4j.org
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