Forum: Ruby on Rails Rails Hosting Questions

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Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-09 00:42
Hi everyone,

I use Hostgator as my hosting provider and I checked out the versions of
the apps they are running:

Linux CentOS: 5.3
Ruby: 1.8.5
Rails: 2.3.2
MySQL: 5.1.30

I've been programming on a windows box but I do have a virtual linux box
setup (not for this particular model) - I wasn't even aware that people
still used Ruby 1.8.5..

My current platform for development is:

Windows Vista 32
Ruby: 1.9.1-p129
Rails: 2.3.2
MySQL: 5.1.30

Do you think that there will be some problems with my development
platform when it goes over to production?

What steps do you think I should take (I'm in the process of setting up
a vbox for the exact specifications of my host) just in case the host
setup doesn't work properly?  Is there a better hosting provider than
Gatorhost that will work well with Rails that houses the ability for me
to setup my own environment?

Thanks..
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-09 01:38
Update:

I did find one review site which is pretty solid:

http://www.webhostingjury.com/

It actually listed my current provider #5 which is good but I can
definitely confirm that hostgator does not ruby on rails in their
mindset...

I'm currently talking to Lunarpages to see what type of VPS plans they
have since they are listed #1 on the list.  Since I'm going to go down
the top 3 or 4 I'll just provide updates on what I find out to save
someone else some time if they happen to read this.
Frederick C. (Guest)
on 2009-06-09 01:39
(Received via mailing list)
On Jun 8, 9:42 pm, "J. D." <removed_email_address@domain.invalid> wrote:
> I've been programming on a windows box but I do have a virtual linux box
> Do you think that there will be some problems with my development
> platform when it goes over to production?
>
I'm always a fan of having a development setup that is as close as
possible to the production setup. There are plenty of differences in
the ruby standard library, behavior of the language and even syntax
between 1.9 and 1.8

Fred
Robby R. (Guest)
on 2009-06-09 01:48
(Received via mailing list)
J.D.,

You might check us out at http://railsboxcar.com/.

One of our guys just did a short screencast showing off our deployment
process.

* http://screencast.com/t/9UoB8oYy

Cheers,
Robby


On Mon, Jun 8, 2009 at 2:38 PM, J. D.<removed_email_address@domain.invalid>
wrote:
>
> I'm currently talking to Lunarpages to see what type of VPS plans they
> have since they are listed #1 on the list.  Since I'm going to go down
> the top 3 or 4 I'll just provide updates on what I find out to save
> someone else some time if they happen to read this.
> --
> Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
>
> >
>



--
Robby R.
Chief Evangelist, Partner

PLANET ARGON, LLC
design // development // hosting w/Ruby on Rails

http://planetargon.com/
http://robbyonrails.com/
http://twitter.com/planetargon
aim: planetargon

+1 503 445 2457
+1 877 55 ARGON [toll free]
+1 815 642 4068 [fax]
Developer In London (Guest)
on 2009-06-09 02:00
(Received via mailing list)
I have a virtual server with slicehost. They are quite good so far for
what
I need and keeps the cost low. I would also look at mosso, who own
slicehost
and offers  a pay as you go version which works out cheaper.

Nayeem

2009/6/8 Robby R. <removed_email_address@domain.invalid>

> Cheers,
> > http://www.webhostingjury.com/
> > Posted via http://www.ruby-forum.com/.
> PLANET ARGON, LLC
>
> >
>


--
cashflowclublondon.co.uk

                      ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._
                       `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)
                       (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                     _..`--'_..-_/  /--'_.' ,'
                    (il),-''  (li),'  ((!.-'
.
Rails H. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 01:07
>
> Do you think that there will be some problems with my development
> platform when it goes over to production?
>
Hi,

I just noticed your post. I made a post today that you may find quite
relevant.
http://www.ruby-forum.com/topic/189024#new

My local configuration is similar to yours. I've been with BlueHost for
quite some time and generally I am happy with them--but not for Rails.

I'm a newbie so you by all means, consider the source for anything I
say.

I am using Sun's VirtualBox for a lot of my Ruby and Rails learning. But
I no longer start projects that I think I might want to keep.

I found porting to other servers quite challenging at times, so I
wouldn't recommend that approach.

Read my other post and if you have questions, I'm happy offer what
little help I can from my very humble level.

Steven
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 07:09
Well, if anyone manages to read this:

Nightmare #1:  Always ask the hosting provider (before signing up on a
VPS) exactly what linux distros they have available.  When you find your
provider only has (ONE) - CentOS 4.5 (final) you have to realize that
this provider won't be a good one (regardless of their reviews).  Why?

CentOS 4.5 does not have access to a lot of beneficial repositories.
The best I found without going out and compiling by source was Ruby
1.8.1.  Most CentOS VPS templates have Yum installed.  Not so yummie...
Sure you can install apt and try to download packages but the type of
packages you'll want will have been made specifically for ubuntu.

I'm not saying it can't be done - but, what I am saying is it is most
likely going to be a nightmare.

Nightmare #2:  The Linux distro is only one complication.  What is your
application going to really need to work at the end?  How are you going
to port your app over to the server?  Does the provider understand ruby
or rails?  I'm finding that the one I signed up for does not.

==============

Currently waiting for a refund from Lunarpages (highly recommended by a
lot of review sites).

Here's some updates on my searches:

1.  Hostgator (doesn't support VPS environments - only shared and
dedicated) - Great service, great cost, great uptime but you are going
to pay 15 bucks a month for shared or 190 bucks a month for dedicated.
If you do manage to get shared, they can upgrade ruby to 1.8.7 and
install as many gems as you need through their ticketing system.  But,
with shared - you have no write access to anything and can't work on any
issues firsthand should they come up.  Dedicated is more expensive with
hostgator than other sites.

2.  Lunarpages (supports all environments) - Great service, great cost,
great uptime but they aren't ruby and rails saavy.  They only have one
VPS environment CentOS 4.5 and their current ubuntu template isn't due
out for months.  They have no backend management for the ruby
environment.  A complete waste if you find them.

-----

continuing my search with some of the suggestions here..
Maurício L. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 07:18
(Received via mailing list)
Want a nice VPS?

Go for slicehost or linode, you won't regret it. Also, try to use
Ubuntu, as there's plenty of material about setting up an environment
to deploy RoR applications, it's also dead easy to manage and
configure.

And i never heard of those two hosting companies you spoke about.

-
Maurício Linhares
http://codeshooter.wordpress.com/ | http://twitter.com/mauriciojr
Maurício L. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 07:21
(Received via mailing list)
And before I forget, when you sign up for a VPS you are assuming FOR
YOURSELF the responsability of managing your own install. Unless
you're hosting with a company that provides application installation
support (like EngineYard) the folks from your hosting service are not
likely to help you to setup your server or install the libraries you
need.

In a VPS you're expected to know what you're doing.

-
Maurício Linhares
http://codeshooter.wordpress.com/ | http://twitter.com/mauriciojr
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 07:28
Maurício Linhares wrote:
> Want a nice VPS?
>
> Go for slicehost or linode, you won't regret it. Also, try to use
> Ubuntu, as there's plenty of material about setting up an environment
> to deploy RoR applications, it's also dead easy to manage and
> configure.
>
> And i never heard of those two hosting companies you spoke about.

I'll do some research on those two as well...

Thanks mate.

Hostgator has been around for awhile (pretty good with the exception of
the issues I spoke about).  Lunarpages I looked on a few review sites
and they are probably a good company but just not rails oriented.

I have no problems with the expectations of managing my own VPS.  I've
done it for many years before I went with a smaller plan.  I can use
Plesk, cpanel, SSH but with VPS's you can't install OS distros because
they are templated.  So, you can't just decide to say hey I think I'll
toss ubuntu on here.  Unfortunately, you have to ask the company you are
hosted for if they have an ubuntu distro available.  In my case, the
hosting provider does not.

I'm definitely going with ubuntu but I'm going to make sure the new
provider has everything that I need before committing.

I use ubuntu on my VMWare box on windows and love it.
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 07:33
My research list for VPS sites will be:

Slicehost
Railsboxcar
Linode
Hostingrails

Anyone have others that are rails-centric and support VPS for ubuntu?
Robby R. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 08:09
(Received via mailing list)
On Tue, Jun 9, 2009 at 8:33 PM, Älphä
Blüë<removed_email_address@domain.invalid> wrote:
>
> My research list for VPS sites will be:
>
> Slicehost
> Railsboxcar
> Linode
> Hostingrails
>
> Anyone have others that are rails-centric and support VPS for ubuntu?
>

We're Debian-based (Etch).

* http://railsboxcar.com/

Get in touch with us...

Robby


--
Robby R.
Chief Evangelist, Partner

PLANET ARGON, LLC
design // development // hosting w/Ruby on Rails

http://planetargon.com/
http://robbyonrails.com/
http://twitter.com/planetargon
aim: planetargon

+1 503 445 2457
+1 877 55 ARGON [toll free]
+1 815 642 4068 [fax]
Marnen L. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 09:04
Älphä Blüë wrote:
> My research list for VPS sites will be:
>
> Slicehost
[...]

Slicehost is *great*.  Excellent management interface, wide selection of
distributions, no hassle.  I generally set up my clients' slices there
with Ubuntu (usually an LTS release), Apache, Passenger, Ruby EE, and
PostgreSQL (I'm not a fan of mySQL).  Pretty easy.

BTW, Slicehost was recently bought by Rackspace, probably my favorite
dedicated hosting provider.  So that makes it twice as cool!

Best,
--
Marnen Laibow-Koser
http://www.marnen.org
removed_email_address@domain.invalid
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 18:04
Marnen Laibow-Koser wrote:
> Älphä Blüë wrote:
>> My research list for VPS sites will be:
>>
>> Slicehost
> [...]
>
> Slicehost is *great*.  Excellent management interface, wide selection of
> distributions, no hassle.  I generally set up my clients' slices there
> with Ubuntu (usually an LTS release), Apache, Passenger, Ruby EE, and
> PostgreSQL (I'm not a fan of mySQL).  Pretty easy.
>
> BTW, Slicehost was recently bought by Rackspace, probably my favorite
> dedicated hosting provider.  So that makes it twice as cool!
>
> Best,
> --
> Marnen Laibow-Koser
> http://www.marnen.org
> removed_email_address@domain.invalid

I did about 4 hours research into the 4 I listed above.  I've narrowed
my choices down to Slicehost or Railsboxcar - those two seem to be very
well versed in rails environments.

Linode was good but it also owns luggage.com and I want a 100% webhost
provider that's focused.

Hostingrails seemed very fishy.  There's only two websites associated
with their IP address and it seems to be hosted mom and pop shop
style...

(Slicehost is in the #1 lead right now) - Unless I can find something
better or Railsboxcar can show me something more - that's my go to at
the moment.
Developer In London (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 18:25
(Received via mailing list)
I would also look at mosso or rackspacecloud. Their price as I said
before
is a bit more competitive then their own Slicehost.

2009/6/10 Älphä Blüë <removed_email_address@domain.invalid>

>
>


--
cashflowclublondon.co.uk

                      ("`-''-/").___..--''"`-._
                       `6_ 6  )   `-.  (     ).`-.__.`)
                       (_Y_.)'  ._   )  `._ `. ``-..-'
                     _..`--'_..-_/  /--'_.' ,'
                    (il),-''  (li),'  ((!.-'
.
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 18:32
Developer In London wrote:
> I would also look at mosso or rackspacecloud. Their price as I said


Checking that out..
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 20:02
Okay I did some more research into slicehost and spoke with people
regarding that site:

The good news is they have a good article foundation for setting up
slices.

However, each slice (vps) is bare bones and has to be setup completely
from scratch.  This means that they have absolutely nothing on them.
You have to setup your SSH, firewall, Apache, PHP, MySQL, Ruby etc. all
from scratch.  In addition, they use 64-bit slices so this adds another
piece into the puzzle.  However, you can always add ia32-libs to work
with 32-bit apps on 64-bit..

They also do not have cpanel or plesk to manage your vps.  They use
another type of manager (slice manager) to manage your vps.  If you need
to get Cpanel it's a monthly charge for the license.  You can still
setup plesk for free though..

I'm still going to look into the others and take my time.  I just wanted
to update this topic in case someone runs through here and finds it and
reads my notes for what I discovered.

For those of you using slicehost, can you confirm or add to any of my
notes and/or provide some of your own experiences with setup?  Did you
find it very difficult?  How about porting over sites from another
webhost to slicehost.
Developer In London (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 20:37
(Received via mailing list)
2009/6/10 Älphä Blüë <removed_email_address@domain.invalid>

> from scratch.  In addition, they use 64-bit slices so this adds another
> piece into the puzzle.  However, you can always add ia32-libs to work
>


SSH is installed otherwise you cant ssh to their server. Apache, PHP,
MySQL
and Ruby are installed also. Firewall is also installed. These things
come
standard with most linux distribution nowadays.
I have never had any trouble regarding the 64 bit. With Mosso there is a
very good documentation on installing and configuring the server.
Slicehost
also has a fairly detailed documentation.


> with 32-bit apps on 64-bit..
>
> They also do not have cpanel or plesk to manage your vps.  They use
> another type of manager (slice manager) to manage your vps.  If you need
> to get Cpanel it's a monthly charge for the license.  You can still
> setup plesk for free though..


I dont run a hosting company, so I never felt the need for cpanel,
havent
been a big fan of cpanel or plesk either. I use their DNS system to add
my
domain names. Slice Manager is quite good. What I like most is their
backup
service where I can backup a whole image of my system and restore it
whenever I want. It also keeps weekly and daily backups automatically.
Slicehost charges an extra $5/month but Rackspace does it for free at
the
moment. So same server slicehost sells for $20+$5 ($25) can cost about
$13
with rackspace.


>
As I said, I dont use slicehost for hosting. I must admit with just
256mb
ram and a slice of the CPU it might not be the most ideal if you run a
heavy
site. You might be better off with a dedicated server and do your own
backup.

Hope this helps.

Nayeem
klochner (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 20:41
(Received via mailing list)
On Jun 10, 12:02 pm, "Älphä Blüë" <removed_email_address@domain.invalid>
wrote:

> For those of you using slicehost, can you confirm or add to any of my
> notes and/or provide some of your own experiences with setup?  Did you
> find it very difficult?  How about porting over sites from another
> webhost to slicehost.

I started using slicehost recently and have had a good experience with
it.
The articles are well written, and they're good about helping out via
their chat service.

My only prior linux administration experience was running linux on an
older laptop, which hardly compares with setting up a server.  I had
no
real problems with getting it going (setting up postfix with google
apps
mail took a little finesse), and I found the learning experience to
be
useful in itself.

That said, you do incur a labor cost in administering your own server.
You should look at engineyard if you want to take a lot of that work
out of your hands.   They're expensive, but they offer a lot of
configuration
and deployment automation/consultion, and they have the esteemed
Ezra Z. on staff.
Marnen L. (Guest)
on 2009-06-10 21:53
Älphä Blüë wrote:
[...]
> You have to setup your SSH, firewall, Apache, PHP, MySQL, Ruby etc. all
> from scratch.

Not quite.  SSH is there, and I seem to remember that Apache is as well.
I think Ruby is also, but I use Ruby EE for production hosting, which is
a relatively simple installation.  I've never looked for PHP or mySQL,
since I don't really use either one.

>  In addition, they use 64-bit slices so this adds another
> piece into the puzzle.  However, you can always add ia32-libs to work
> with 32-bit apps on 64-bit..

I don't think I've ever needed to do that (unless some package installed
it for me).  I've never had any compatibility problems on Slicehost.

>
> They also do not have cpanel or plesk to manage your vps.

You're right, but those are generally more trouble than they're worth.
I usually put Webmin on my servers, which in my opinion is far better.
[...]
>
> For those of you using slicehost, can you confirm or add to any of my
> notes and/or provide some of your own experiences with setup?  Did you
> find it very difficult?

It's not difficult at all -- of course, it wasn't my first Linux setup
either.

> How about porting over sites from another
> webhost to slicehost.

I should think that you could either use Capistrano and you SCM for
that, or you could just put the whole thing into a tarball and copy it.

Best,
--
Marnen Laibow-Koser
http://www.marnen.org
removed_email_address@domain.invalid
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-11 01:11
Marnen Laibow-Koser wrote:
> Not quite.  SSH is there, and I seem to remember that Apache is as well.
> I think Ruby is also, but I use Ruby EE for production hosting, which is
> a relatively simple installation.  I've never looked for PHP or mySQL,
> since I don't really use either one.

Marnen/Klochner:

Thanks for the feedback on this.  I managed to get a full refund from
the hosting provider I went with and so now I can go with a VPS that is
managed with rails in mind.

I sent an email (awaiting a reply) from slicehost about what is
installed already on their slices.  I need to have PHP and MySQL because
my old website was developed using both.  I need to keep the initial
site up until I'm ready to port over the rails distro..

I noticed you said you use Ruby EE for production hosting.  I've been
looking into this as it seems very interesting.  Is Ruby EE difficult to
setup?  And, if you use Ruby EE for production, what are you using for
development?  Just curious..

Slicehost may be the way I will go...
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-11 01:15
Okay I received my answer:

Reply was:

As previously stated, our images are bare bones installations and do not
come with many common applications such as Apache, MySQL and PHP
pre-installed.

I have attached a list of the installed packages on a default slice.

adduser            install
apt            install
apt-utils          install
aptitude          install
base-files          install
base-passwd          install
bash            install
bsdutils          install
busybox-initramfs        install
bzip2            install
ca-certificates          install
console-setup          install
console-terminus        install
coreutils          install
cpio            install
cron            install
curl            install
dash            install
debconf            install
debconf-i18n          install
debianutils          install
dhcp3-client          install
dhcp3-common          install
diff            install
dmidecode          install
dmsetup            install
dpkg            install
e2fslibs          install
e2fsprogs          install
eject            install
file            install
findutils          install
gcc-4.3-base          install
gnupg            install
gpgv            install
grep            install
gzip            install
hostname          install
ifupdown          install
initramfs-tools          install
initscripts          install
iproute            install
iptables          install
iputils-ping          install
kbd            install
klibc-utils          install
klogd            install
laptop-detect          install
less            install
libacl1            install
libatm1            install
libattr1          install
libblkid1          install
libbz2-1.0          install
libc6            install
libcap2            install
libclass-accessor-perl        install
libcomerr2          install
libcurl3          install
libcurl3-gnutls          install
libcwidget3          install
libdb4.6          install
libdb4.7          install
libdevmapper1.02.1        install
libedit2          install
libept0            install
libfribidi0          install
libgcc1            install
libgcrypt11          install
libgdbm3          install
libgnutls26          install
libgpg-error0          install
libgpm2            install
libidn11          install
libio-string-perl        install
libkeyutils1          install
libklibc          install
libkrb53          install
libldap-2.4-2          install
liblocale-gettext-perl        install
liblockfile1          install
libmagic1          install
libncurses5          install
libncursesw5          install
libnewt0.52          install
libpam-modules          install
libpam-runtime          install
libpam0g          install
libparse-debianchangelog-perl      install
libpcre3          install
libpopt0          install
libpython2.6          install
libreadline5          install
libsasl2-2          install
libsasl2-modules        install
libselinux1          install
libsepol1          install
libsigc++-2.0-0c2a        install
libslang2          install
libsqlite3-0          install
libss2            install
libssl0.9.8          install
libstdc++6          install
libtasn1-3          install
libtext-charwidth-perl        install
libtext-iconv-perl        install
libtext-wrapi18n-perl        install
libtimedate-perl        install
libusb-0.1-4          install
libuuid1          install
libvolume-id1          install
libwrap0          install
libx11-6          install
libx11-data          install
libxapian15          install
libxau6            install
libxcb1            install
libxdmcp6          install
libxext6          install
libxmuu1          install
locales            install
lockfile-progs          install
login            install
logrotate          install
lsb-base          install
lsb-release          install
lzma            install
makedev            install
mawk            install
mime-support          install
mktemp            install
module-init-tools        install
mount            install
nano            install
ncurses-base          install
ncurses-bin          install
net-tools          install
netbase            install
netcat            install
netcat-traditional        install
ntpdate            install
openssh-client          install
openssh-server          deinstall
openssl            install
passwd            install
perl            install
perl-base          install
perl-modules          install
procps            install
python            install
python-minimal          install
python2.6          install
python2.6-minimal        install
readline-common          install
sed            install
ssh            install
startup-tasks          install
sudo            install
sysklogd          install
system-services          install
sysv-rc            install
sysvinit-utils          install
tar            install
tasksel            install
tasksel-data          install
tcpd            install
tzdata            install
ubuntu-keyring          install
ubuntu-minimal          install
udev            install
upstart            install
upstart-compat-sysv        install
upstart-logd          install
util-linux          install
vim            install
vim-common          install
vim-runtime          install
vim-tiny          install
wget            install
whiptail          install
x11-common          install
xauth            install
xkb-data          install
zlib1g            install
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-11 01:19
For clarification the bare bones applies to "all" slices but the list of
installed applies to ubuntu - which was what I was asking about...
Marnen L. (Guest)
on 2009-06-11 01:26
Älphä Blüë wrote:
[...]
> I noticed you said you use Ruby EE for production hosting.  I've been
> looking into this as it seems very interesting.  Is Ruby EE difficult to
> setup?

No.  You may have to adjust a few symlinks, but that's not hard and
there's info on the Web about what exactly you need to do.


> And, if you use Ruby EE for production, what are you using for
> development?

The Ruby 1.8.6 interpreter that came with Mac OS X 10.5.

Best,
--
Marnen Laibow-Koser
http://www.marnen.org
removed_email_address@domain.invalid
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-11 02:10
I am now a new member of Slicehost.  Thanks everyone for assisting me
here.
Joel D. (Guest)
on 2009-06-11 17:33
In case anyone reads this thread - Slicehost measured up to all the hype
given it.  It is fantastic.  I got my slice yesterday evening and by the
next morning my complete site is up and running from start to finish.
It was not as difficult as I thought it would be.

Also, the admins have a chat room and I sat in the chat room and anytime
I encountered an issue or had a question they answered me immediately!
They are there 24/7!

Everything has gone as smooth as a baby's bottom.  I'm very happy and
excited.

I wanted to say thanks again for letting me know about the site.
This topic is locked and can not be replied to.